WILL-I-AM THE MURDERER

2/5/2019

The following is highly speculative and not intended as a solution to the identity of the Zodiac Killer, moreover, an exploration of the January 29th 1974 Exorcist letter in which the author wrote the tantalizing words "Signed, yours truley". Usually the word "signed" would be followed by an author's name, either in full or part. The author of the Exorcist letter stated "Signed, yours truley: He plunged himself into the billowy wave and an echo arose from the suicides grave, titwillo, titwillo, titwillo".

The designer of the Exorcist letter was seemingly substituting the signature with a verse from The Mikado's Tit-Willow. In other words, it could suggest his name is present somewhere within the verse. The Zodiac Killer (if the author) chose a verse not in keeping with his two previous Mikado selections, As some day it may happen and A more humane Mikado - both of which had threatening overtones of torture and murder. Whereas, Tit-Willow is about a little tom-tit's last reflective moments before his suicidal plunge into a billowy wave. This may suggest the verse Tit-Willow was chosen for an entirely different reason, particularly in view of the preceding line of "Signed, yours truley" notable on the Dear Boss letter signed by Jack the Ripper and postmarked September 27th 1988, just three years after The Mikado opened at the Savoy Theatre. It should also be noted that William S. Gilbert, responsible for the libretto of The Mikado, released Songs of a Savoyard in 1890 featuring many of the songs from their comic operas. Six songs from The Mikado can be found in Songs of a Savoyard, three of which Zodiac chose - assuming of course, Zodiac was responsible for the January 1974 offering.

Click to enlarge letter

Did the Zodiac Killer embed his name somewhere in his communications as he had promised in his later correspondence? - giving away his forename would certainly not lead to his capture. It has been speculated that the Exorcist letter was a contemplation of suicide on behalf of the author, however, this is hardly in keeping with the threatening overtones of the Bay Area murderer and certainly out of kilter with the foot of the Exorcist letter which threatens to "do something nasty, which you know I'm capable of doing". It gives the impression that he is threatening to take somebody else's life, not his own.

There is a strange dichotomy evidenced in the letter, where the author begins by referencing 'The Exorcist' movie (1973) and immediately follows it up by paraphrasing 'Tit-Willow' from 'The Mikado' (1885). 'The Mikado' is often described as the best in British satire, as well as a comedy opera, therefore the word usage of the author describing it as a 'satirical comedy' is unlikely to be accidental. Additionally, the attempted blending of these vastly different productions into one correspondence seems forced, as if chosen for a specific purpose.

The libretto or text was plagiarized from William S. Gilbert. The Exorcist is an American horror film released in 1973, directed by William Friedkin and adapted for screenplay by William Peter Blatty, based on his 1971 book. The movie divided audiences and critics alike, as it explored the subject of demonic possession, in this case, that of a 12-year-old girl played by Linda Denise Blair. This masterpiece of evil still remains one of the most iconic movies in the horror genre to this day. It is fairly evident that the three main protagonists in these productions all have the forename "William". It is also apparent that every verse of Tit-Willow ends with "Oh, willow, titwillow, titwillow!", in which the name "Will" can be observed three times. The shortened version of William is also present in "billowy". Did the Zodiac Killer choose the Tit-Willow verse after "Signed, yours truley" for no other reason than it contained his name embedded in the text? The next line after "Oh, willow, titwillow, titwillow!" is "Now I feel just as sure as I'm sure that my name".

Bearing in mind the estimated age of the Zodiac given as between 25-45 in 1969, this would make his birth date between 1924 and 1944. So, from a statistical standpoint, I looked at the most popular boys names in the USA in the 1920s, 1930s and 1940s. William was ranked 4th highest in the 1920s with 512,400, 4th highest in the 1930s with 416,646 and 4th highest in the 1940s with 556,399.

In the April 20th 1970 '13 Symbol' cipher, Zodiac stated "This is the Zodiac speaking. By the way have you cracked the last cipher I sent you. My name is...." The cipher contained three characters twice (A, N, and M) and one character three times (joined O and 8). Therefore, the name "William" gives us a good starting point with two repeating letters.

As an experiment, I looked at the most popular American surnames that could possibly fit the criteria required by the '13 Symbol' cipher and the already inserted "William". Sixteenth on the list was the name Martin, giving us an estimated name of William Martin for the Zodiac Killer. There are many alternative second names that could be applied, but if "William" was the responsible's forename, we would be looking for a 6-letter surname for the confirmed murderer of five.

2/5/2019 10:22:56 am

The theme of water plays prominent in both the Zodiac and Sir William Schwenck Gilbert's Mikado. In fact: Gilbert died of a heart attack while attempting to rescue a young woman to whom he was giving a swimming lesson in the lake at his home. From Wikipedia

But, it does seem that the Zodiac writer is pointing out the name "William" more than the speculated "Sullivan" that many have postulated.

My Name Is Mine

2/6/2019 03:11:05 am

You are 100% correct BB. The theme of water appears to be a constant in the Zodiac communications, and water is often associated with death. The Zodiac also killed most, but not all of his victims near water.

2/5/2019 11:59:42 am

William J. Grant

Rubislaw 32 link

2/5/2019 01:02:25 pm

Certainly ''brave'' of you,BB,to mention a name [Mr.Grant's],when ''William'' and derivatives,like ''Bill'',are not uncommon Christian names.

But....if we go right back to the beginning,and Lake Herman Road.The very first suspect,of adult age,was William J.Grant.

Why ?

Largely undocumented reasons...but can only be,I suggest,because of suspicions of appearing to own,the same motorcar,as the perceived perpetrator.

That was the start of it,and Leslie Lunblad,chief investigating officer,was never convinced otherwise.

A small matter of ''impersonation'' to consider,though.....and why the ''Real Zodiac'',should have wanted to impersonate Mr.Grant,in the first place.

''Core Motive'' will reveal ''all''.

My Name Is Mine

2/5/2019 09:23:00 pm

I find myself agreeing. The specter of William Grant hangs over the Zodiac case like a bad smell that refuses to go away.

Lieutenant Husted of Vallejo PD investigated and reported on Grant at length in May of 1977. The following circumstantial points were noted by him:

1) The suspect (Grant) resembles both composites when compared to his driver's license photo taken in 1969.
2) The suspect had a military background and received 7 months training in military code work and was then an instructor in cryptography.
3) The suspect was known to Darlene Ferrin's family. Her family alleged that the suspect in question made three separate phone calls to each family member within 1-1/2 hours of Darlene's death. The calls were made prior to any media announcement of the Vallejo Homicide. The family members claim that all calls made specific reference to Darlene.
4) The suspect had allegedly been stalking Darlene for many hours at the restaurant where she worked as a waitress.This has been verified by a VPD Officer Baldino who picked the suspect's photo out of a line up and indicated the suspect had been seen at the restaurant conversing with Darlene some time prior to her death.
5) A stalking incident in Vacaville regarding a young woman who had been receiving threatening letters and phone calls may be connected to this suspect. Witnesses identified the suspect as the same man who had been seen sitting in a parked car in the area where the woman lived. Witness descriptions of the man's vehicle and appearance accurately match with those of the suspect. The man was also accurately described by witnesses as the same man seen following the woman when she went to a mountain area to visit a relative, some 200 miles North of her home.
6) The suspect was unemployed at the time of the sightings and was also unemployed during each of the periods of reported Zodiac activities. Suspect is a member of AA since 1962. His visits to AA have provided him with a certain amount of freedom from family responsibilities, especially at night. It appears the suspect frequently went out at night and was gone for long periods of time which cannot be accounted for.
7) The suspect lives in a thickly wooded and remote area dominated by pine trees and the residence is only visible if you look down between the pines from the roadway. In going to the area Lt. Husted noted that during the period when Zodiac had mentioned being swamped out by rain, the suspect's roadway and general vicinity had been heavily flooded.
8) The suspect owned a vehicle that approximates the car used at the Vallejo Homicide, being a white 1961 Chevrolet.
9) A young woman by the name of Karen [redacted] was a babysitter for the deceased Darlene Ferrin during January through March, 1969. She reports an incident where a male person matching the description of the suspect was watching the residence of Darlene one night before her husband returned. The witness questioned Darlene about the man and she replied that she had seen this man commit a murder and Darlene named the man, but Karen could only recall that the name was brief and sounded common. The witness complied to further interviews. Karen stated for the record that she had quit in May because she had guilt feelings about covering up for Darlene's extra-marital affairs, and she mentioned one of the men as being the surviving victim Michael Mageau. She underwent a hypnosis session at Concord PD but apart from adding some extra details to her description of the suspect and his vehicle, she could not recall the name Darlene had spoken. Whenever she would get close to revealing the name she would say she was being disturbed by the sound of a phone ringing.
10) The suspect was a known homosexual who frequented a rest area on Hunters Hill engaging in sexual activities. As homosexuality was still illegal at that time, the suspect was questioned about his activities by Sergeant Lundblad. At this time the Sergeant also questioned him about another incident relating to the suspect's hostile manner towards a CHP officer.

At the time of investigation, Grant was living in Massachusetts, which as many have noted is close to the city of Albany. His residence in 1969 was Suisun City, California and he worked as a real estate agent in Fairfield, California.

The names, dates, witness statements, and circumstances are all on public record and cannot be ignored!

Richard

2/5/2019 01:14:40 pm

Courtesy of https://murderincorp.wordpress.com/author/murderincorp/

The defection of two National Security Agency cryptographers to the Soviet Union in July 1960 led two Congressional committees to hold executive hearings in September on the matter.

The two men, Bernon F. Mitchell of Eureka, Calif., and William H, Martin of Ellensburg, Wash., left the NSA on vacation June 24, due back July 11. The Defense Department declared them missing Aug. 1 and Aug. 5 said “there is a likelihood they had gone beyond the Iron Curtain” but they had no information that would be “prejudicial” to the United States if it fell into Soviet hands.

At a Sept. 6 Moscow press conference, Mitchell and Martin said they were “worried” about U.S. airspace violations, “disenchanted by the Government's practice of intercepting and deciphering the secret communications of its own allies,” and felt that the U.S., “in carrying out policies dangerous to world peace, should not be allowed to rely upon…emotional attachments to guarantee the loyalty of its citizens.” They said they had left in a Maryland safe deposit box a “parting statement” to explain their departure, read a copy of it and said it had been “suppressed” by the Administration.

Mitchell and Martin also said that in February 1959 they had talked to “a Congressman who had publicly expressed concern over the State Department's concealing from Congress pertinent facts” about a U.S. C-130 plane shot down over Russia in September 1958. They said they informed the Congressman of the plane's “intelligence mission,” which Martin had learned of from an NSA “high official,” but that their conversation with the Congressman was interrupted when he received a call from William Macomber, assistant secretary of state for congressional relations, who requested him to “refrain from further public discussion of the C-130 incident.”

A Sept. 8 news story said Rep. Wayne L. Hays (D Ohio) might have been the Congressman Mitchell and Martin said they had visited, and that, in a telephone interview at his home, Hays said two men representing themselves as employees of the Central Intelligence Agency had visited his office with such a story. Hays, according to the news story, said he did not believe the men looked like the published pictures of Mitchell and Martin, that he did not recall any phone call from Macomber on the plane incident, and that he had reported the men's visit to the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

In Washington, White House Press Secretary James C. Hagerty Sept. 6 told newsmen President Eisenhower considered the two men “self-confessed traitors.”

Richard

2/5/2019 01:23:25 pm

Courtesy of https://murderincorp.wordpress.com/2019/01/31/whos-there/

William Hamilton Martin (May 27, 1931 – January 17, 1987) was born in Columbus, Georgia. His family soon moved to Washington state where his father was president of the Ellensburg Chamber of Commerce. He graduated from Ellensburg High School after two years. After studies at Central Washington College of Education (now Central Washington University), he earned a degree in mathematics from the University of Washington in Seattle in 1947. He enlisted in the United States Navy and served from 1951 to 1954, working as a cryptologist with the Naval Security Group in Japan. Martin played chess and collected Japanese sword handles (tsuka)

Drew

2/5/2019 11:13:31 pm

Good stuff Richard!

My Name Is Mine

2/5/2019 05:34:10 pm

I have always felt those scrambled letters at the bottom say "ELK" rather than "KILL". If you re-arrange the letters they can in fact resemble the way the word Elks appeared on some lodges. Just my five cents!

My Name Is Mine

2/5/2019 05:59:02 pm

There is possibly an obscure Shakespeare connection to the recurring theme of "willows" and "drown(d)ings" in the Zodiac communications.

Although I admit the Albany cipher is probably a hoaxed communication, I sometimes try to solve the cipher that came with it. The problem with this cipher is it just isn't clear enough to discern the different characters. I have two versions of it and both look to have different symbols. It appears one may have been a "cleaned up version" which has caused some different symbols to appear more alike, while erasing other subtle differences. Nevertheless I have run various permutations using software. All solutions to date have been horribly partial and inconclusive, but the partials do seem to point to it having something to do with "King Lear" and the word "willow"; although in one variant I got "Leary has finally won" at the end. This is also interesting considering Timothy Leary was having constant problems with the law around that time. The same partial has "leased an island" at the beginning and we know Leary was influenced by a Huxley book called "Island".

The most interesting partial for me seems to hint at a connection with King Lear and other Shakespeare plays. The willow is of course associated with both Desdemona (by virtue of the willow song) and Ophelia who drowns after falling out of a willow tree. Desdemona sings the Willow Song moments before her beloved Othello murders her. This haunting ballad foreshadows her own imminent death.

The Willow Song

The poor soul sat sighing by a sycamore tree
Sing all a green willow
Her hand on her bosom, her head on her knee

chorus: Sing willow, willow, willow, willow!
Sing willow, willow, willow, willow!
My garland shall be;
Sing all a green willow, willow, willow, willow
Sing all a green willow
My garland shall be.

The fresh streams ran by her, and murmer'd her moans
Sing willow, willow, willow
Her salt tears fell from her and soft'ned the stones.

Let nobody blame him, his scorn I approve
Sing willow, willow, willow
He was born to be fair, I to die for his love,

I call'd my love false love but what said he then?
Sing willow, willow, willow
If I court more women, you'll couch with more men.

Note: Desdemona's song from Othello. The earliest copy is in a
lute book dated 1583.

Richard

2/6/2019 04:04:33 am

Can you place your "By Fire" findings into this thread Name is Mine, I thought that is a worthy topic.

My Name Is Mine

2/6/2019 05:06:31 am

Certainly! There may not be any relevance in this Richard, I just thought it interesting in view of the "by gun, knife, rope, fire" idea. I am sure the Mafia would have thought of this long before that comic book ever existed?

Louis Lepke Buchalter “destroyed 11 men by Gun, Knife, and Fire.”

Only one missing from his resume was “by rope”.

So said LIFE magazine on 28 Feb 1944 - Page 86

However, this particular “skill” was taken up by an accomplice, “Pittsburgh Phil”, the “ace” of the Murder, Inc. crew. A meticulous planner, he was equally adept with a gun, a rope, and the tool that became an underworld cliche—the ice pick. He refused to carry a weapon in case he was stopped by the police. But he would study his victim and the proposed murder site to figure out the best method of execution.

Phil at one time decided it would be too noisy to use a gun in a crowded cinema, so he removed a fire axe from the wall, only to find his intended victim had moved up several rows. So he dropped the axe in disgust and headed home, declaring the hit was jinxed. One wonders if death by fire axe could have been deemed "death by fire" if he had carried out his plan? Not that there was any need for such labeling, as Murder Inc. had found numerous ways to do away with their enemies. Fire was just one of many methods they employed.

See also:

https://books.google.com/books?id=U1QEAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA86&dq=lepke+LIFE+28+Feb+1944&pg=PA86#v=onepage&q=lepke%20LIFE%2028%20Feb%201944&f=false

https://books.google.com/books?id=x-KmBgAAQBAJ&pg=PA44&lpg=PA44&dq=mafia+cinema+%22death+by+fire%22&source=bl&ots=L7xYe-Io0B&sig=ACfU3U1cO6LQt8QeJ5LG9TnDu_aAUY2QZw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiT1aLIkKfgAhVPT30KHY6MDt8Q6AEwBXoECAkQAQ#v=onepage&q=mafia%20cinema%20%22death%20by%20fire%22&f=false

As Carl Sifakis writes in The Mafia Encyclopedia, death can take many forms: "death by gun, knife, bomb, rope or poison could well follow... immediately upon receiving a demand."

We do know that the mob was operating in some capacity in San Francisco during the time of the Zodiac. Of course nobody can prove whether Zodiac had any links to the mafia, real or (in his own mind) imagined? In the 340 cipher there are three symbols placed consecutively which do appear to say the word "ACE". Coincidence? Probably!

Richard

2/6/2019 05:29:21 am

A Molotov cocktail was made using a glass bottle filled with petrol or napalm. After filling the bottle a mobster would then use some material to stuff into the top of the bottle such as a cloth or a sock to act both as a stopper and a wick. Usually mobsters would make these by the case load.

The cloth or sock would then be soaked in alcohol, set alight, and then thrown at either a car or a building. The bottle would fly through the air like a fireball and then upon contact would explode like a bomb. The Molotov cocktail would be used in drive-bys, or more preferably thrown into shop windows if store owners hadn’t paid protection money to the mob.

nancy

10/6/2019 04:41:05 pm

This 340 Character poem sounds very Zodiac-esque :)

I felt a Funeral, in my Brain, (340)
By Emily Dickinson

I felt a Funeral, in my Brain,
And Mourners to and fro
Kept treading - treading - till it seemed
That Sense was breaking through -

And when they all were seated,
A Service, like a Drum -
Kept beating - beating - till I thought
My mind was going numb -

And then I heard them lift a Box
And creak across my Soul
With those same Boots of Lead, again,
Then Space - began to toll,

As all the Heavens were a Bell,
And Being, but an Ear,
And I, and Silence, some strange Race,
Wrecked, solitary, here -

And then a Plank in Reason, broke,
And I dropped down, and down -
And hit a World, at every plunge,
And Finished knowing - then -

My Name Is Mine

10/6/2019 07:29:32 pm

Hi Nancy, Very interesting. I wonder how the number of each distinct symbol used in the 340 might compare to the number of distinct letters in the poem? Worth checking if someone has the time!

Rubislaw 32 link

2/6/2019 09:07:07 am

....So,the Tim Holt comic,could have found influence,for the ''Wheel of Death'',from a 1944 Life Magazine issue ?

That makes a lot of sense.

Up to about six years ago,a certain website was claiming that,there was only really one source,for the ''Red Phantom'' influence.When actually,there could be upwards of a dozen sources.

I certainly don't discount ''The town of Zodiac'',that now lies under a ploughed field,as an influence on the Zodiac's name.

But,again,a possible inference is,that the Zodiac drew his influences,from a number of sources.

''We'' should not be so surprised .

Rubislaw 32 link

2/6/2019 11:14:03 am

Gosh...Tahoe 27 will be disappointed [?].

But,no time to sit on our laurels,when there's a ''bad guy'' to be caught.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/6/2019 11:55:18 am

.....So,the Tim Holt ''Wheel of Death'',as an exclusive influence on The Halloween Card,is not so much ''hanging by a thread'',now....as ''dangling on a piece of rope'' [?].

Richard

2/6/2019 12:17:41 pm

I still think the comic is the likely answer, regardless of this other good find.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/6/2019 02:38:52 pm

Yes...genuine thoughts....Zodiac does appear to have been a comic reader,as well as ''literary classics'',from childhood.

And indeed,wasn't ''sniffy'' about populist TV and Radio.

All these influences came about,which we tend to be able to see,though his written words.

One ''small thought'' about the February 1944 Life Magazine issue is,that,it could have been around the time of his birth [?].

And,that he may have had easy access to this issue,as part of mementos held by his parents,to mark his coming into this world.

My Name Is Mine

2/6/2019 03:59:22 pm

My point has been missed. I was not suggesting the mafia thing was the direct and therefore only source for the "by gun, knife, rope" etc. I was merely suggesting that others had no doubt thought of it first. The comic book artist was not working from a "blank slate", he was merely recycling various ideas that had been around for a long time. The ideas were already in the public milieu by way of movies, books, cinema, the press. That was all I was suggesting. I was not trying to poke holes in anyone else's theory.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/7/2019 12:17:53 am

I think that the recycling notion,is understood...and is not being suggested of you,otherwise.

There is only one solution to Zodiac's ciphers....but everything else,has ''multi-layered'' solutions.

The whole concept of ''influence'' is ''inexact''.

The Life Magazine issue is a good find.

2/6/2019 05:50:02 pm

Rubislaw 32
If Grant is the Zodiac for the LHR killings - then he is the real Zodiac and not just a patsy Zodiac. Am I misunderstanding? Please clarify. Because I'm just a few chapters into my first Lafferty book - and yet
you have me under the impression that the Zodiac was not Grant. I'm confused. Peace.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/7/2019 12:49:37 am

You may well be right,BB,regarding the ''Wills'' and ''Bill'' alluding to William J Grant.

Grant was ''not'' the real Zodiac.That has almost conclusively been proved,by the FBI in 2002/2003.

Lafferty,like Lunblad,beleved ''wrongly'' that he was.

But there is gathered and accumulating evidence that,Grant was being fitted up,as the Zodiac,by the real Zodiac.

On this basis,one therefore falls into either of two camps :

Either the real Zodiac,simply picked Grant out of a book,and that Grant was an ''unlucky pick''.

Or,that Grant was deliberately targeted,out of spite...that in effect,Grant was the object of a vendetta.

In the second scenario,it is likely that Grant would have known the identity of the real Zodiac,and would have been able to assist the police,with their inquiries...instead of claiming ''complete innocence'',on the matter.

One should read Lafferty's book....but to bear the the two scenario's in mind.

Personally,BB,I believe that you are ''probably'' correct,to spot the ''Wills'' and ''Bill'',as attributed to Grant....as a subliminal reminder,by the real Zodiac..that they ought to still think that Grant was the Zodiac.

Was Grant a Saint,or a Sinner ...for not ''coming clean'' with the cops ?

That,I believe,will be the historian's ''big question for debate'',after the Zodiac is convicted,and the fuss has died down.

My Name Is Mine

2/7/2019 02:40:22 am

I agree Rubislaw. There is a connection there, I think. Perhaps Zodiac was someone who he met at Hunters Hill rest stop, but Zodiac was not there for the same reason? An odd co-operation of understanding developed between the two, so Grant became a kind of sidekick, doing the dirty work of stalking potential victims and writing the letters/ciphers. The killing was left to Zodiac who had ample research and so his kills seemed like random hits, when actually they were anything but. They were more like planned projects. Grant held his tongue out of fear and Zodiac may have also threatened him in other ways. It is also possible that Grant was forced into performing one of the murders, e.g. the one in which the Zodiac seemingly sprayed bullets everywhere, which seemed out of character for him. It is a plausible theory and fits well with the available evidence. Proving it? Probably near impossible.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/7/2019 05:47:18 am

Naturally,we are theorising here,MNIM,but I think that Grant was ''technically'' a complete innocent.

But he was every bit as ''pig headed'' as Zodiac....and when it became apparent to him,that Zodiac was persecuting him,Grant decided to ''tough it out'',hoping that Zodiac would eventually disappear,from his life.

Grant's reputation was on the line.He was,we now know,a closet bisexual,and recovering alcohol and gambling addict.

But,he had married ''above his class'',had made money out of Real Estate,and was a successful lay preacher,and popular public speaker,for Alcohol Anonymous and the Catholic Church.

Zodiac may have had information on Grant,that Grant would clearly not want disclosed.

Trouble for Grant was,that Zodiac appears to have desired to make Grant's life,a living hell...and even,try to fit Grant up,as him,the Zodiac.

On a personal level,one can see that Grant might have found himself [...when he actually realised ''the terms of engagement''...],between the devil,and the deep blue sea.

And,the cops weren't inclined to give up,on getting to the bottom of Grant,until they fully understood what he might be hiding.

But,we now know that the cops overplayed their hand,and their heavy handedness was recognised in a court of law.

Grant won his injunction,for police harassment,and the police could never touch him,again.

My Name Is Mine

2/7/2019 03:48:30 pm

I recall reading somewhere that Grant was ruled out (a second and final time) not long before his death by a couple of detectives. I do not recall the details or their names. We do not know if the interview was at Grant's request or the detectives took it upon themselves to interview him in the interests of "closure". It is also unclear what Grant told them, but it would appear they came away from the interview satisfied that he had nothing to do with the Zodiac case. Perhaps the detectives had been hoping for a kind of "pre-death bed" confession from him, which never happened. Still, one would wonder why Grant would go his entire life, remaining fearful of the Zodiac into his old age, even taking the secret to his grave. It seems he died on Feb 2 2012 and his wife had died in 2007. One would think he would have at this time thought "F$%# Zodiac, I am going to die soon anyway, and it is no longer frowned on to be gay, so I will get my revenge and spill the beans on him."

We should not under-estimate people like Grant, especially not in their youth. Even some of the "larger than life" serial killers have turned out be lesser insects than Grant. Still he does seem too short and thin to be the man described as the Zodiac by witnesses. I personally cannot rule him out as being the culprit in the Blue Rock Springs "hit", which has all the hallmarks of a jealous lover/stalker seeking revenge. Perhaps in this case, the writer known as Zodiac was more than happy to claim this "kill" as his own, and Grant was more than happy for this stranger to accept the responsibility?

Tom1

2/7/2019 11:30:11 am

This imposter stuff is fascinating. What is puzzling to me is how was it possible for Lafferty to not be able to ID the person posing as Grant. Did he not observe him on the highway? The CHP can make a traffic stop at any time, for a multitude of reasons.

Tom1

2/7/2019 03:23:05 pm

I guess he saw who he thought was Grant on the Hwy, not the imposter. My bad. Could have pulled him over for a multitude of reasons nontheless.

My Name Is Mine

2/7/2019 03:24:13 pm

Hi Tom1, I have found many holes in Lafferty's re-telling of events and when reading his book the question always on my mind is this: "But as a cop why didn't he [do this or that]?" He describes seeing the very angry face of the Zodiac at one point, but seems unable to provide a proper description, and one wonders, why did he not bother to look at the number plates? He often presents things in his book as mind-blowing, then drops them as if they are some kind of "hot potato", not taking them to the next logical step. So I find a great many holes in his "literary report" on Zodiac. On many occasions he also appears to take a form of "poetic license" which really grates with the idea that he was supposedly a highly professional detective! So I have always taken Lafferty's work with a grain of salt, and I do sometimes wonder if his propensity for dwelling on imaginative presumptuousness when faced with uncertain facts may have been at play even during his professional career. We can only hope this was not the case, but at least his literary work on Zodiac does at times suggest an idiosyncratic propensity on the part of Lafferty for mild bursts of "imaginative extrapolation".

Rubislaw 32 link

2/7/2019 02:25:06 pm

Well...the implications Tom 1,are that whenever Zodiac was out and about,in his car,playing ''cat and mouse'' with the cops,as a sport...he always drove his ''William Grant'' same model car,complete with Grant's licence plates.

He just had the balls,to never have his car and him,properly checked out,by the highway cops.

Firstly,the highway cops would have to actually catch him.And,on those rare occasions,when individual cops,like Lafferty,might spot him,at a major car park,like Hunter's Hill....they would really have no legal justification,to give him a ''proper going over''.

Naturally,Zodiac wasn't the only motorist that played ''cat and mouse'',with the cops....but he [...the person we know as Zodiac...] did start getting a reputation,with some Highway Cops,such as Lafferty.....but,of course,they all assumed,from a distance,that this person was Grant.

Then,the one occasion,when a cop got close to thinking about giving ,the person,assumed to be Grant,a proper checking.....and in this case,Lafferty....''Zodiac'' essentailly scared Lafferty off,from considering it further.

Although it sounds a comical set of circumstances,one should always have sympathy for Lafferty.In a way,Lafferty just ''held his nerve....and if Lafferty had had his time,over again,he probably would have just taken his gun out,and shot ''the Zodiac impersonating Grant''.....and answer questions,at a later date.

My Name Is Mine

2/7/2019 03:59:36 pm

I would like to question this point in Lt. Husted's report in greater depth:

3) The suspect was known to Darlene Ferrin's family. Her family alleged that the suspect in question made three separate phone calls to each family member within 1-1/2 hours of Darlene's death. The calls were made prior to any media announcement of the Vallejo Homicide. The family members claim that all calls made specific reference to Darlene.

I admit I have paraphrased Husted's report (above) in order to fit it all in to a single post, but the meaning is basically the same.

Any ex-cop would find a lot of faults with Husted's subjective manner of reporting. He leaves too much in question and it is sometimes difficult to know if he is blurring the lines between real and circumstantial evidence. It is like he is trying to build a case against Grant, rather than allow the facts to speak for themselves.

So with this in mind, I must ask (if anyone can tell me) is there conclusive proof that Grant was known personally by the members of the Ferrin family, or were they merely pointing at a suspect photo and saying "that looks like the man we saw"? Secondly, did each of the members of the Ferrin family state specifically that they recognized the voice on the phone as being Grant's voice, or were they being coached to believe this, either by one another, or by the investigating officer?

I must say, Husted's reports is one of the worst I have ever seen in my life. It is so open to misinterpretation and so full of holes that anyone in a court of law could drive a cement truck through it.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/7/2019 05:19:13 pm

I think you are right to have misgivings,about the Husted report.Apart from ''someone'' more than likely stalking Darlene,the rest should go in the trash can.

However,one should never morally challenge the bereaved of a victim,for desiring that their lost love one,is kept at the forefront of police investigations.

The Husted report,is technically,an illegal report,and Lt.Husted should,strictly speaking,have been fired for having created it.

Apart from anything,the implied suspect,Grant,was no longer allowed to be a suspect,legally.

One can,though,understand why the report was made.There were a lot of police hurting over Grant's success,in keeping them away from him.The police felt that the law courts had treated them harshly,over their efforts for Grant to open up....and some,of course still believed that Grant was actually the Zodiac.

So,it appears that Husted elected to create this document,as a historic testimony to his officers,who had actually acted in good faith,in attempting to bring the truth to the surface,on the Zodiac case.

But,historically,it seems to have largely backfired....and only added,albeit misplaced derision,to the reputation of the Vallejo Police Department.

2/7/2019 05:56:08 pm

Richard

Some food for thought
The dot in Morse code is an "e"
MK is used to stand for CIA projects
Good Herb AKA Yerba Buena was the original name of San Francisco
as the Origin spot plaque says at the corner of * Bush and Grant
And these sites - I found interesting
http://mk-zodiac.com
https://www.carandclassic.co.uk/list/21/zodiac/
http://mk-zodiac.com/sandy2.html

3/21/2019 04:21:09 pm

Correction the Plaque is at Washington and Grant.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/7/2019 06:37:50 pm

Just to add,MNIM,and as far as I am aware,Darlene did know Grant,merely on recognition though.

When Grant was still gambling,he used to come into Terry's Restaurant,of a morning,before visiting one of the illegal gaming basements,in Vallejo....just to quietly read the newspaper,and have a coffee.

Darlene,a waitress,and ''middle-aged'' Grant,were never on ''name'' terms,and may have,at most,exchanged a few pleasantries.

There is ''little to no chance'' that Grant would have been invited to,nor accepted an invitation to,Darlene's painting [pot] party.

My Name Is Mine

2/8/2019 02:23:34 am

Thanks RS, Certainly explains the "strangeness" of that report.

My Name Is Mine

2/8/2019 05:42:33 am

Still, it is very interesting that all of the entries for "G" have been removed (torn out?) from Ferrin's and Crabtree’s address book!

Rubislaw 32 link

2/9/2019 07:31:29 am

Perhaps while we are on the subject of ''Grant/Zodiac'',and the ''Imposter/Persecutor'' scenario,it might be worth,at least looking at the Benicia High School Note :

'' [ I'm sorry ] but ''Byson'' sould have said anything about me blow up the school so I will do it between now and the 22 of Dec.

So I kill ''Byson'' and you will find him up by Lake Herman Road.

If you get up their in time you will find him before the dog eat him up I hope they do.

Guess Who Thiz Hiz Blood Off.

[...a blood smearing...]

You Die Zodiac

I'm Gona Do My Thing At Qir School. ''

--------------

AS with the 1990 Celebrity Cipher copy,being offered to Lyndon Lafferty,by the V.P.D.,the Benicia High School Note was similarly offered to Lafferty,on a visit to the Benicia Police.

The Note is believed to have been posted on the front door of the school,in Autumn 1972,and retrieved by the janitor.

This particular time,would have been,just after William Grant's injunction success,against police harassment.

Naturally,the note could be just a hoax,but I would suggest that,although seeming to be written by a ''backwater half-wit'',it is anything but [?].

If we accepted that the Note is by the hand of the Real Zodiac,then...

The inference may be that the Real Zodiac has decided that,he will now paint the picture of him,the Real Zodiac,and Grant,in a sort of nefarious partnership [....since the Real Zodiac accepts that he has failed,so far,to pin the blame for his crimes,on Grant...].

With this new scenario in mind,the Real Zodiac writes this Note....but pretending that the Note is by the hand of Grant,referring to him,the Real Zodiac,as ''Byson'' [...''Bay's Son''...].....and further suggests that the police should pick up ''Byson'',before the ''dog'' eat him up [...The ''DOJ'' - the Department of Justice....].

Yes....it's all a bit convoluted,and can get quite complicated.But,the essence is,that the Real Zodiac is attempting a new strategy,to fit Grant up...even if it means,the Real Zodiac being arrested for his crimes,as well as Grant.

This may be an indication of just how much vitriol the Real Zodiac had,towards William J Grant.

My Name Is Mine

2/9/2019 02:14:28 pm

"By gun, by knife, by fire, by rope" + "By Son"?

Is there a copy of the Benicia note anywhere online RS?

Rubislaw 32 link

2/9/2019 04:36:25 pm

Yes...its available,in Lafferty's book,online,Page 197.Also,with [easy] menbership,to Ricardo's ''ZKM'' site,in enlarged form.

Whenever I read it,I can't help laughing,at apparent absurdity of it,from a ''warped'' perspective.

But,I have a feeling that,in years to come,the expression ,'' I'm gona do my thing at Qir [Queer] School '' is going to become,almost as well known,as '' This is the Zodiac speaking ''.

Initially,Lafferty interpreted ''Qir'',as ''Air''...incorrectly,of course.But actually,the ''same'' Real Zodiac is referring to the ''same'' Grant,anyway...with Grant,having trained as an Air Cadet instructor,during WW2.

How can we ''amateurs'' possibly know about ''authenticity'' of the Note ?

We can't,naturally.....however,it is most unlikely that Lafferty would have been allowed to walk away,with both this Note,and the Celebrity Cipher...without expressed permission of the FBI and CA DOJ.....and ''not'' the two provincial police forces,mentioned.

A ''small'' matter that seemed to be lost on Lafferty.

The ''real'' question is,would the FBI and CA DOJ have ''fed out'',effectively,to ''the public''.....a couple of ''dud'' Zodiac correspondences [?].

My Name Is Mine

2/9/2019 04:47:11 pm

"This is the Zodiac speaking! You die!!! Now I'm gonna go off and DO MY THING at Queer School!"

This is too funny for words!!!!!

But it does tie in well with Grant and with that rather campy Celebrity Card too!

My Name Is Mine

2/9/2019 04:55:49 pm

I must add, if that letter with the smeared blood is still in police files, and not "lost" as so many of them appear to be, surely they could get a very good DNA sample from it for testing. If nothing else, the DNA would rule it in or out as a legitimate Zodiac communication. They should at least be able to determine whose blood that may have been, or at the very least, if it is human, animal, or bird.

2/9/2019 12:45:34 pm

Rubislaw 32
While I never really gave your POI a fair enough shake. I always thought in the background that you were such a good guy that you just could not be blowing smoke all this time. Then on his own - Richard collated that the correspondence says the name William again and again. While at that moment I was on a picture of the Dragon's Gate on Grant street. Bingo. The only legitimate POI with the name William is William J. Grant (13 characters). William Joseph Grant (18 characters) was married to Marion M. Grant who died in 2007. She Grant's wife was having an affair with judge Raymond J Sherwin and who also was president of the Sierra Club - the one on the postcard. Bill was from Middlesex, MA. And joined the Air-force in 1942. He was a radio operator, and knew codes. Although the "picture" we have of Willy is a murky one, I think that that may be by design. He is however at the center of this case. And, if the Zodiac writer and killer is a team of two or two hundred - it does not matter we have to focus on the Zodiac scape goat in this guy Bill Grant. This is at least a good starting point for a renewed investigation. The red tape can be cut to this case by using the Rico statute as there is clear blackmail and or cover up still in violation. The Rico act will allow LE to take their investigation almost anywhere. Nothing off limits. I suppose I need to also credit Gareth Penn too for his Radian line. As, it goes right through the Dragon's gate (the Axis Mundi) to Washington and Maple. But, all this time you have been the one saying that it is Lafferty and Lundblad that identified William Grant as at least the central character in the Zodiac case. And, your probably thinking I told you so. You could have just listened to me all along. And, my response - sorry pal, I am a procrastinator. Peace

My Name Is Mine

2/9/2019 02:28:46 pm

He does seem intricately connected by way of the circumstantial evidence, that much is certain, and I would be unable to rule him out with relation to the Mageau/Ferrin "hit". I would even be willing to suggest the possibility that the Zodiac took credit for this crime, when the real villain was Grant. There are a few grey areas which I am sure Vallejo PD could clarify for us, but of course they never will, not even if we approach them "nicely" with the questions. I fear that some of the crumbs they have thrown the public to date are only the superficial "vagaries" and half-truths from their investigation.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/9/2019 05:16:10 pm

These are all pertinent points made,By BB and MNIM.

One shouldn't feel bought on the notion that the Real Zodiac was fitting up an ''innocent'' Grant....if uncomfortable,with the idea.

I believe that,in essence,this was the case....but it does become increasingly difficult to understand....what apparent hold on Grant,that the Real Zodiac seemed to have...to stop Grant feeling inclined to simply ''run to the cops'',and ''spill the beans'' on what the Real Zodiac,was up to.

Such is the way,that humans behave,in a crisis....that the rest of us humans....may never understand.

But I believe that one thing that we can be all in agreement is....that if Grant was the victim of the Real Zodiac's persecution....then he,Grant,must have been the most selfish man on the planet....by not coming clean,with the cops.

Well,so it may well be the case that,he,Grant....was ''that'' selfish in putting his own reputation,above all else.Even ''probably'' allowing his wife to succumb to a nervous breakdown,when he realised that it would be better,if he told her the truth of the matter.

Marian had probably threatened to leave Grant....and it was his only way of keeping her,from doing so....playing ''the sympathy card'' [?].

Of course,the way Lafferty saw it was,that Grant simply told Marian that he,Grant,''was'' actually The Zodiac [!].

Surely,if Grant was the Zodiac,and just came out,and told this to Marian....she would have fled into the night,crying ''Blue Murder'' [?].

No...there had to be another explanation...which nevertheless made Marian very upset and depressed.

And,I would suggest,constitutes the ''Core Motive'' of the Real Zodiac.

''That'' which explains nine tenths of the whole case.For,the implications are,that if Grant was being impersonated and persecuted by the Real Zodiac,then....

Grant was the Real Zodiac's ''main objective'',who became the Real Zodac's ''side dish'',when ''infamy'' beckoned,with the press and establishment's attention.

In effect,Zodiac's real weakness,was as a compulsive extortionist.

I don't believe that Zodiac hid his or Grant's actual names,in his puzzles or ciphers.

Those places are not,where to look.

To unlock the key to the reason why the Real Zodiac persecuted Grant,in the first place...is to find a solution to the whole case.

And ultimately,the identity of the Zodiac Killer.

Tom1

2/10/2019 07:33:31 am

Would Mr. Z have risked being discovered by impersonating Grant? This stuff is fascinating. Is it pure fantasy to speculate than someone else, who knew them both was the imposter? It would not be that unrealistic that Grant had several enemies. "Hell hath no fury".Grant risked everything by going public with a court action vs LE. This Zodiac affair is going to suck up what limited brain cells that I have left. UffDa

Rubislaw 32 link

2/10/2019 10:02:49 am

The impressions of Grant,Tom1,is of someone ''self-contained'',who conducted himself with decorum in public,but could be a bit ''prickly'',if one got too close.

Grant's wife,Marian,was a well liked person....very ''giving'' of herself,and a popular social hostess.Pretty much the ''opposite'' of her husband.

Despite Grant's apparent coldness,he could clearly turn it on,as a public speaker....and obviously was quite ''gifted'' at selling a piece of land.

On ''hearsay'' it is always possible that he had accumulated more than one enemy.

My personal opinion,though,is that ''Zodiac'' 's enmity was very specific,and particularly to extent of vitriol.

Although Zodiac would have wished to fit Grant up,initially with being able to sneak off,''untouched''.....as time went on,Zodiac seems prepared to ''go down with the blazing ship'',if necessary.

That having been said,Zodiac was still a coward,at heart.

My Name Is Mine

2/11/2019 12:36:09 am

There is probably more there evidence-wise on Grant than LE ever had for Allen Leigh, that much seems certain to me! Whenever I look at the evidence for Leigh's supposed guilt, I always come away scratching my head. They had nothing but a lot of seemingly biassed testimony from various individuals plus a small helping of highly circumstantial evidence. It was as if he was the local pervert known to inhabit the area, and he wore a Zodiac watch and said a lot of stupid and obscure things to incriminate himself, plus he had a falling out with a friend who seemed more than willing to tar and feather him at any opportunity. So for Leigh, was it merely a case of "He molests children! Let's get him!"????

My Name Is Mine

2/9/2019 06:10:49 pm

Something else to consider Rubislaw,

The letter was pinned on the door some time in 1972-3.
On April 10, 1972 one of the worlds' biggest earthquakes occurred. It was called the Qir Earthquake.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_Qir_earthquake

Now, which contemporary serial killer do we know who, by his own admission, was a "scholar" of earthquakes? The guy even formulated his own bizarre "physics-like" equations about them.

From Wikipedia: By 1972, Herbert William Mullin was 25 and had moved back in with his parents in Felton, California (located in the Santa Cruz mountains). By now he was hearing voices in his head that told him an earthquake was imminent, and that only through human sacrifice could he save California.

Mullin's birthday, April 18, was the anniversary of the 1906 San Francisco earthquake, a date which he thought was very significant.

[The Qir Earthquake had shaken the world just 8 days prior in 1972! In Mullin's mind, cosmic forces were aligning!]

Mullin believed that the Vietnam War had produced enough American death to forestall earthquakes as a sort of blood sacrifice to nature, but that with the war winding down by late 1972, he would need to start killing people in order to cause enough deaths to appease nature and prevent the imminent earthquake.

On October 13, 1972, Mullin beat Lawrence "Whitey" White, a homeless man, to death with a baseball bat. White, 55, had been hitchhiking on Highway 9 and Mullin struck him down after tricking him into looking at his car engine.

Mullin was to claim later that the victim was Jonah from the Bible, and that he had sent Mullin a telepathic message saying, "Pick me up and throw me over the boat. Kill me so that others will be saved." White's body was found the next day.

Although Benicia is a couple hours drive north of where Mullins lived, it is plausible that he followed the main highway north on some insane mission to get to San Francisco, where he foresaw the epicenter of the coming earthquake.

Herbert Mullin's artwork and handwriting are rather similar to the Zodiac's in many respects. It would not be surprised in fact if he was riding the Zodiac's wave of infamy, if we consider he may have posted that note on the school door. He was perhaps looking for free advertising space and thought the Zodiac "badge of approval" may help promote his own agenda.

My Name Is Mine

2/9/2019 06:39:21 pm

Re the Mullin's possibility and the "by son" detail, I should have added that Mullin claims that prior to killing, he heard a command hallucination in his father’s voice, “Herb, I want you to kill me somebody.” At the same time he became obsessed with charts about birth and death rates and began formulating extravagant but mostly baseless scientific equations, in order to legitimize, explain, and predict his beliefs. Any earthquake predictions he picked up on in the press made things worse, because it focused his delusions and gave him a specific goal. So in his mind he was literally following his father's command: hence "By Son". I guess he also considered himself to be a "son" of Nature, as he believed his destiny (pre-determined by his birth date) was to prevent the Earthquake.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/10/2019 04:36:48 am

Some fascinating information and thoughts,MNIM.

I had no idea about the ''Qir'' earthquake [!]....it must be ''more'' than a coincidence [?].And,of course, ''adds'' to the credibility of the Benicia High School Note being authentic Zodiac.

Perhaps Zodiac,at his sarcastic best [?].

Also,the ''Mullins'' reference.When the film ''A Clockwork Orange'',first came out in December 1971 [ USA ],and January 1972 [ UK ],there were two scenes that caused the most controversy.One was a girl being gang raped.The other was of a homeless man being beaten to death by a young man.

The two ''glorification of violence'' references,attributed to ''Zodiac'',in 1959 and 1974,as mystifying perceived hypocrisy,and the ''now'' possibility of Zodiac having threatened the life of film director,Stanley Kubrick,over ''A Clockwork Orange'',might start having some understandable meaning.

There is supposed to be a seven page handwritten letter,in the HEARNAP files,that although referenced,I have yet to find.From ''someone'' to the authorities,it is,apparently,signed :

'' My name is Stanley ''.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/10/2019 12:38:07 pm

Ah...I have the reference details,on the '' My name is Stanley '' letter :

Envelope postmarked ''NEW YORK NY 10001 1974 PM 27 OCT'' bearing the handwritten address ''Mr.Floyd Burger [editor] Daily News 220 East 42nd st. NY,NY. and accompanying seven-page handwritten letter; first page beginning ''Mr.Burger kindly inform...'' and signed on the seventh page ''My name is Stanley''

The FBI go on to state that the letter was subsequently found ''not'' to have known associations with the SLA.

It had been ''wrongly'' put in their anonymous section,for the SLA.

So....what's the betting that,the letter was eventually found to be associated with Stanley Kubrick [?].That the FBI finally found a home for the letter,in the Kubrick file [?].

The ''Stanley Kubrick FBI File'' which has now been removed from public viewing.

Ref : HEARNAP File 22 , Page 398 .

Richard

2/10/2019 12:54:04 pm

Nice find Rubislaw.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/10/2019 01:21:06 pm

Thanks Richard.

I just checked up on New York's ''The Daily News'',and found that it was founded in 1919.Not actually owned by W.R.Hearst....but,the first Tabloid newspaper,in the U.S.,following London's ''The Daily Mirror''.

''Speculative'',I know....but it may well be that,the seven-page letter,starts : ''Mr.Burger kindly inform Mr.Hearst....''

With ''this'' being why the FBI wrongly categorised the letter,as ''SLA'' related,in the first place [?].

Yes...it seems to be shaping up,nicely,with the ''subliminal message'' of the published ''2001 New Year's Card''.

Something,along the lines of :

'' Dear Zodiac,we know you extorted Randolph Hearst,but perhaps you didn't realise that we found out that it was you,who served actual death threats on Stanley Kubrick ? Oh yes you did.

We now have enough on you,to put you away for a very long time.So,how about doing the decent thing,and give yourself up ?

It won't be long,before we come for you,anyway.

Our name is ''The FBI'',just in case you didn't know.

FBI - 2 , Zodiac - 1

We win.

My Name Is Mine

2/10/2019 02:29:01 pm

Richard and Rubislaw, Why do you think the FBI keep pulling these files?

I had the same thing happen to me when I wrote on a forum about a file I had found in their online archives. Next time I looked, the file had vanished! Was it because I had inadvertently stumbled on to a possible link to a person who is still living? Perhaps so!

But really, why put something in the public domain and then remove it as soon as someone finds it useful and makes a comment about it?

And this is evidently the same FBI that now steadfastly refuses to hear out anybody who has a theory about the Zodiac. When it comes to Zodiac it seems the FBI are much like the SFPD, far out of reach and not contactable. If we do actually get to communicate with a real human in LE, more often than not we are told the case is old and closed and nobody is working on it. So why would they even be remotely interested in what we the public think about these moth-eaten old files, long discarded as "irrelevant scraps" by the FBI themselves?

2/10/2019 11:31:22 am

Has anyone noticed all the TV, film and theater references in the Zodiac case?
1. RKO Tim Holt
2. RKO Citizen Kane
3. The Exorcist
4. Badlands
5. The Mikado
6. Dirty Harry, and others
The Zodiac seems to have been an actor in a group like maybe the Lamplighters. Or, it is even possible he was a small time tap dancer.
Robert E. Hunter Jr. was an actor at the Bohemian Grove on Thursdays.
https://www.legacy.com/obituaries/sfgate/obituary.aspx?pid=167440132
But, it is likely that with all these, the Zodiac writer caught the acting bug.

My Name Is Mine

2/10/2019 02:35:31 pm

I could be wrong, but I think what we are looking at here BB is a person who is unable to differentiate between the real world and fantasy. It is often a common problem suffered by serial killers. His frequent sojourns into movies and fictional stories and comic books are really not all that surprising in this context. You could be correct of course. He may have been an actor. I personally see him as someone on the sidelines or someone who mostly sat in the audience, dreaming about things and imagining himself in similar real life situations.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/10/2019 06:21:43 pm

With regard to the FBI files,MNIM,there is a whole page of ''small print'' on recommended usage,and the FBI's rights for file removal etc.

This file removals section,includes the mention of ''ongoing cases''.So,it may be the case,with an aspect to the Zodiac case.

This morning,when I responded to your ''Qir'' and ''Mullins'' finds,I was denied direct access to Richard's site,for a couple of hours,thereafter.This also happened to me a few months ago,when I accused ''the authorities'' of conducting a political witch hunt,to remove a senior policeman.

So,perhaps,as in the film ''Days of the Condor'',there are employed ''readers'' for government organisations,that have to check people out,that write things,on the internet.In the old days,it used to be ''the printed word'' in newspapers and journals,of course.

I am no longer entirely surprised.But I think that,of more relevance,for the Zodiac case is,the division of responsibility,from ''LE's'' perspective.

The FBI were,in effect,''hired'' by the CA DOJ,after the murder of Darlene Ferrin,on the basis of their expertise with extortion...and the apparent element of extortion,that was becoming part of the case.

The Bay Area police forces were largely unaffected,in their murder investigations....just working on individual cases....and sending the information,up the line,to the CA DOJ.

But,then ''paths'' and ''boundaries'' of investigation,crossed and became ''blurred'',with a few ''hiccups'' occurring.

To-day,the case really is,only about the FBI and ''DOJ'' 's.The police are only employed to communicate with the public.....and ''not very well'',as in the case of the VPD who,after all,are just obeying instructions,from ''above''.

For the amateur,the only ''in'',is probably through ''those'' FBI files....hunting around for ''scraps''....that are mostly to do with the extortion side of the Zodiac case.

2/11/2019 03:36:24 pm

William J. Grant is the fall guy for the Zodiac possibly using ciphers that when cracked only point to WJG as being a patsy. It goes without saying that - I'm just speculating here. Trying to help piece together a fifty year old case with just circumstantial evidence. So it is going to be a lot of hit and miss. And, a hell of a lot more miss than hit for sure. And, as far as exploring the possible notion that the Zodiac could be an actor - some examples are - Ross Sullivan being a small time actor. And, Lawrence Klein MC-ing night clubs and dating actresses. And, even getting hitched to a famous singer. These are the top two suspects according to the FBI and the History channel's Hunt for the Zodiac series. Here they are talking to the Lamplighter's Roger Pierson about a suspicious guy that attended the show "The Mikado".

YouTube
Ken and Sal Head to San Francisco's Theater District on "Hunt for the Zodiac Killer'
ttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnN1XNi8dKs

Rubislaw 32 link

2/10/2019 11:39:40 am

Yes.....the ''Mullins'' link to the Benicia High School Note,is ''stunning''.

It really illustrates,that the Zodiac had an ''overactive'' mind [?].

News reportage,on the ''Qir'' earthquake,April 10th 1972,Southern Iran :

''.....the land surface wave magnitude of the earthquake,was registered as 7.0 at the Pasadena seismological station,7.1 at Berkeley,and was set at 6.9 by NOAA .''

[....National Oceanic and Atmospheric,U.S.Department of Commerce...]

Rubislaw 32 link

2/11/2019 05:47:06 pm

it is interesting your mention of Grant,as Zodiac's ''fall guy'',BB,and ruminate about what we might find,within the cipher solutions,that could point to this.

From a personal perspective,it is really ''Z38'',where I have Grant down,as the subject,of the Zodiac.

But,first one needs to be convinced,that the Fairfield letters,of December 1969,are authentic Zodiac.

The first ''Fairfield'' letter,of December 7th 1969,contains the ''Z38'' cipher.

The second ''Fairfield letter of December 16th 1969,contains the '' Z5+4'' cipher.

Both ciphers,on appearance,alone,appear to be ''cut and paste'' ciphers,taken from Z340.

On this basis,one is inclined to think that the Zodiac employed the same cipher keys,used in Z340,for both Z38 and Z5+4.

I ''went'' with this,and found that Z5+4 has a solution,referring to the American Automobile Association.

And,that Z38 has a solution,referring to Grant.

I have not that found Grant referred to elsewhere....apart from ''Scorpion's'' S5 cipher solution,where it might be Grant,that is being referenced on two occasions.

''Scorpion's'' S5 cipher can be placed,circa 1994.

The FBI's Cryptanalysis Unit,have this information...so,naturally I am not bothered,if others remain unconvinced.

We should,perhaps,bear in mind that,the FBI and CA DOJ,have not authenticated anything,since 1978.

And,then [1978],it turned into a public relations disaster....so,perhaps that is part of the reason why [?].

Rubislaw 32 link

2/11/2019 07:23:53 pm

Crikey....a certain Zodiac website has now clocked up 88 pages of posts,ruminating on DNA,as a result of a statement from Detective Poyser,referring to something about ''envelopes'' and a ''secret lab''.

This is fast becoming the greatest hoax,since ''The Piltdown Man''.

Quite ironic,really,since it was Poyser's VPD,who were the hoaxed,over Zodiac's impersonation of Grant.Enough anyway,to blow the chances of the case,finding an early resolve.

It must have been a bitter pill for the VPD to swallow [?].

And now,all that the VPD are left with,is to dish some of their unpalatable medicine out on an innocent public.

The penny must surely drop,at some point,for this certain site [?].One member has recently stated,perhaps optimistically,that ''No news is good news''.

I beg to differ.....''No news is no news''.

Kid Charlemagne

2/12/2019 07:41:25 am

Rubislaw, your “Piltdown Man” comparison is right on the mark! There are other signs of desperation at that subject Z website. The admin there and his mod(s) are bumping decades old threads – vids on cronies and failed researchers – in a frantic attempt to stir forum activity and to stall answering the pertinent questions. He told us 2018 was going to be the BIG Reveal year!

In order to drum up further hits for his flagging site and credibility, that admin is presently on Reddit trying a new tact: an unctuous ‘good guy’ Q&A campaign under yet another username. This, he initiated in the same hour that he stopped using previous identities to rancorously and vulgarly abuse Reddit forum members, for weeks! Zodiac aside, there is someone in the community who needs to be evaluated for his motives and Dissociative Identity Disorder.

I am astounded that VPD and its Internal Affairs remains okay with giving this maladaptive and demonstrably unstable man “inside source” access. For starters, Det. Poyser cannot retire soon enough, if you ask me.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/12/2019 04:01:39 pm

Thanks for the insightful feedback,Kid Charlemagne.

Yes...one doesn't rejoice in seeing a website of some 3000 members,led down a garden path,to a place of folly,but....

It does become inevitable,when the site's leader eschews rational thinking,trading in his vanity so easily,based on an invitation to a police station basement,decked out with ''theatrical props'',to mark the occasion.

And,to be greeted by ''rubber gloved'' Terry,who we were informed,was a ''really cool and sweet guy''.

''Hook,line and sinker'' is the expression,I believe [?].

My Name Is Mine

2/12/2019 02:29:40 pm

88 pages of pure speculation? That has to be some kind of record for sure! Still they have not yet surpassed the number of pages printed in books, which have frequently speculated wildly on Zodiac, all presenting supposedly "watertight" cases to support their different suspects, but ultimately all propped up by half-baked and flimsy evidence.

I somehow doubt those 88 pages are the responsibility of a single police department. They merely loaded the gun. The internet community are the ones who are trigger happy with the truth.
And I also notice certain "regular" commentators among the commenters on those 88 pages, all adding their own little slices of innuendo to the mix. I see the same follies practiced by some, over and over; one being the attempt to start little fires and then fan the flames with increasing speculation, as if to manifest a conclusion to their own liking. I really am not surprised by any of this.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/12/2019 04:25:19 pm

Yes MNIM,'' " They merely loaded the gun.'' seems to be ''on the money''.

From a long term observation,part of the problem for the site leader,is his claim of ''two interviews'' with Mr.Grant.The SF newspapers have never been convinced of this claim,and believe that this site leader,only made the claim,in order to besmirch Lyndon Lafferty,in public.

One does wonder that,if the ''two interviews'' claim is true....then what did they actually talk about [?].The weather,for instance [?].

We all have our theories,because the site leader has never divulged this information.Apparently,the interviews were conducted,on the phone,and that Grant was '' a really nice guy ''.

My thoughts are,that the phone interviews,were on the short side.With,possibly the second call,Grant saying something along the lines of :

'' Didn't I tell you the first time,to never call me again ? ''

Kid Charlemagne

2/12/2019 06:38:17 pm

PLEASE hold the applause! Nothing is going to happen until Tom’s big furry hat says so. Behold! Today on Reddit, the hat has spoken:

T.V. on DNA & case resolution: “I am optimistic and always have been. And if it doesn't happen in 2019, I believe it will in 2020.”

20/20? Now, isn’t that ironic?

type-o

2/13/2019 11:08:49 am

Ironic definition, using words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning

My Name Is Mine

2/13/2019 02:17:28 pm

There is more to the definition of irony than the simplistic one presented by type-o, and as such the context in which Kid Charlemagne uses the word is perfectly correct.

noun: irony

1. the expression of one's meaning by using language that would normally signify the opposite, typically for humorous or emphatic effect.
synonyms: sarcasm, sardonicism, dryness, causticity, sharpness, acerbity, acid, bitterness, trenchancy, mordancy, cynicism; More
mockery, satire, ridicule, derision, scorn, sneering;
wryness, back handedness; informal sarkiness
antonyms: sincerity

2. a state of affairs or an event that seems deliberately contrary to what one expects and is often wryly amusing as a result.
plural noun: ironies
synonyms: paradox, paradoxical nature, incongruity, incongruousness, peculiarity
antonyms: logic

3. a literary technique, originally used in Greek tragedy, by which the full significance of a character's words or actions is clear to the audience or reader although apparently unknown to the character.
noun: dramatic irony; plural noun: tragic irony

Origin of word: early 16th century (also denoting Socratic irony): via Latin from Greek eirōneia ‘simulated ignorance’, from eirōn ‘dissembler’.

type-o

2/13/2019 03:17:03 pm

"The historical record shows that irony and ironic have been used imprecisely for almost 100 years at least, and often to refer to coincidence."

F. Scott Fitzgerald

My Name Is Mine

2/13/2019 05:00:30 pm

Oh of course! silly me, F. Scott Fitzgerald being the expert and all!

Regardless of what Fitzgerald may or may not have said about it, Kid Charlemagne's use of the word is 100% legitimate.

Kid Charlemagne (Not Alanis Morissette)

2/13/2019 06:06:37 pm

MNIM, correct, and thank you.

20/20 (adjective) “denoting vision of normal sharpness,” i.e., absolutely NOT what we’re getting from some Zodiac killer case site admins and law enforcement depts.

It was not a "type-o" (snicker).

I Ronny

2/13/2019 10:19:07 pm

One could say that it is VERY IRONIC that type-o does not appear to understand the correct use and subtleties of irony! :-)

Socrates = 1
type-o = 0

Rubislaw 32 link

2/12/2019 06:03:59 am

Hi Richard.

I have found the '' My name is Stanley'' letter,in the HEARNAP files.

As was becoming apparent,the FBI have ''shuffled up'' many letters,quite deliberately.Something I had been getting the impression of,with anything to do with the Joan Webster case,in the Zodiac files.

It just must be the FBI's ''way'' [?].'' Well,you can't say we didn't give out the information,to the public...they just have to find it.'' [?] [?].

Anyway,the ''Stanley'' letter is quite ''scrawled'',but mostly readable.

It starts : '' Mr Burger kindly inform William Randolph Hearst....

Firstly,isn't that Randolph Apperson Hearst's late father....specifically [?].

Or,were father and son,known as ''senior'' and ''junior'' [?].

There is a reference to ''Palmerston'',the Victorian British Prime Minister....associated with ''Gunboat Diplomacy''.But it is quite mystifying,on first inspection.

I'll have a go at ''translating'' the letter...then ''post'' to you,with reference.

Then,some of your readers might like to try [?]....and we can draw comparisons.

My Name Is Mine

2/12/2019 03:59:49 pm

"I'll have a go at ''translating'' the letter...then ''post'' to you,with reference.

"Then,some of your readers might like to try [?]....and we can draw comparisons."

Or you could post us the link and we could all have a "go" at the same time? But either way is fine with me. :)

Rubislaw 32 link

2/12/2019 07:00:16 pm

Here is the letter in question :

Saturday Oct.26th.

Mr.Burger

Kindly inform Mr.William Randolph Hearst his daughter Patricia is in Chicago.She has an office or offices in the Wrigley Building.

400 off Michigan across the street from Tribune Tower and on the other side,the Times Building.

The office or offices were rented after the armoury incident in Calif.

She has an accomplice or accomplices under an assumed name.But has been jailed for a year.Financed by a wealthy and prominent black man,whose withdrawals from a bank were enormous,to finance everything.

The Symbionese have increased in membership and have expanded.From Calif. to Chicago,Cleveland,Buffalo and NY of city.Time is of the essence,of great importance,the pot of coffee and the pot of stew are going to boil over.The volcano is ready to erupt.

I would like to have an audience with the FBI Criminologist and Psychiatrist.Be sure you have the E.S.M.P.P. society.

The ''Perceptive'' people.

They will be very helpful and beneficial to us all.I will be brief and specific and come to the point.I want a book out.''Palmerston'' the British Statesman.I forgot the author.New York and England publication.Page 304 in parenthesis.It reads this.Persistence means [?] etc etc etc.

By the way Patricia Hearst may be disguised as a blond or redhead.Probably wearing spectacles.

Insert an ad in Personal Columns reading this,Tuesday or Wednesday.

Stanley

See me in my office FBI

Your signature

My name is Stanley

--------------------

2/12/2019 05:16:41 pm

William Randolph Hearst, inherited the San Francisco Examiner from his father in 1887. Jack the Ripper along side the Mikado terrorized London with Yellow journalism in 1888.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_journalism

William Randolph Hearst became a mass murderer when he faked the news and started the Spanish–American War with the made-up picture of a woman being strip searched - stochastically killing thousands.

"Stochastic terrorism is the use of mass communications to incite random actors to carry out violent or terrorist acts that are statistically predictable but individually unpredictable. In short, remote-control murder by lone wolf. "

http://stochasticterrorism.blogspot.com

Also, very, yellow press-like sort of show "The Mikado" (where white male actors wear out-fits mocking geisha women, only it's worse because they not only mock people of another race - they make fun of Asian culture and the way they dress and the way they speak and they even mock all women - by instead of actually hiring women to play the roll of women and actually hiring Asians to play the roll of Asians - The bigots use white men to dress up and poke fun of the language and the differences of eastern culture. The Mikado is bigoted vile tripe - the very best example of chauvinism and racism) it's akin to the wearing of black-face. And, it should have been left in the 1800's. We now know the effect of this tabloid journalism that Hearst seemed to eventually regret too - in the fomenting of the Spanish–American War. Also used in the film - known as "The Birth of a Nation" This right we have - the freedom of speech. In the hands of dishonest people - has proven time and time again that it can get people to act out violently through the use of adhominimal rhetoric. It has cost people their lives - through the fomenting of violence. Now in the form of fake news. It's really getting crazy out there with the BBC camera man getting attacked at the rally today. This form of speech is akin to crying fire in a crowded theater(but not in one playing "The Mikado"). This form of speech is propaganda. It is as illegal as "using them fighten words". The Patriot Act clears the way for this Hitler divisive language to be pulled back into use.
The Zodiac sold more guns than any one since Hitler. With Dirty Harry saying go ahead ... Make my day (.44 magnum in hand) to a facsimile of the Zodiac. And this is why we must overturn The Patriot Act which the powerful told us would only be used to take our rights away from us for a year - until the Iraq war was over. 911 was 18 years ago. And, there is no mention of them giving us back our rights. Power corrupts completely. Semper Fi

Rubislaw 32 link

2/12/2019 07:54:30 pm

Some notes on the ''My name is Stanley'' scribe :

It is ''Jasper Ridley'' who was the author of the biography on Lord Palmerston [1970].The parenthesis quote on Persistence,Page 304,is,apparently available online,with the ''National Library of Australia''.Based on quick references,this is indicated to be,to do with Palmerston's philosophy on Anti-semitism,when holding the position of Foreign Secretary,before becoming Prime Minister.Palmerston was against the removal of Jews from Europe,but advocated the restoration of a Jewish settlement in British Palestine,if European Jews wished to move there.

The E.S.M.P.P. society,seems to stand for ''Educational Services Master Plan Project'',which was the concept of an academic ''think tank'' at Peralta Community College,Oakland,CA....and was to be financed by The World Bank....whose President was Robert McNamara.

The whole concept was centred around ways and means to promote and provide,further education for Adults.

So,probably ''Adult Education'' and ''Jewish Liberation'' were the underlying messages,from '' My name is Stanley''.

However,we ought to bear in mind,that he was a hoaxer...so,what,if anything about the letter,is true....is in the hands of the FBI.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/12/2019 08:00:26 pm

The ''My name is Stanley'' letter,is presumed to have been written on October 26th 1974,and received by Mr.Burger,Editor of the Daily News,October 28th 1974.

Ref : HEARNAP File 24 , Pages 775 - 786 .

My Name Is Mine

2/12/2019 10:11:07 pm

Thanks Rubislaw. I am not convinced that communication was from the Zodiac, even though the writer does not sound entirely sane. The use of "My Name is Stanley" as a closing taunt, suggests the writer wanted to possess the infamy of the Zodiac for shock value. The hoax communications have one thing in common. They frequently try to connect their own agendas to Zodiac. They are like clumsy surfers all trying to hijack his wave and continue riding it to shore. While jostling for their respective literary positions, most trip themselves up and get thrown off backwards.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/13/2019 01:46:27 am

Yes,I understand your reservations,MNIM....who is really to say,except the FBI,who might know,either way [?].

With the letter's actual content,there is,perhaps,a bit of Zodiac's orientation obsession going on....plus ''the blond and redhead'' seems to ring a bell,with the Bates Confession letter.And of course,the ''My name is''.But,don't see much more.

The underlying messages,could be ''one'' for Catherine Hearst,and ''one'' for Randolph Hearst.The ''Education'' message for Catherine,with her ''suppression'' measures,as a University Regent.And,a dig at Randolph's father's support for the Nazi Party,in the 1930's,with the Jewish message.

I have found a fuller section,devoted to the ''Niagara Hoaxer'',that sent two letters,from Buffalo,NY to the Niagara Gazette,about six weeks,before ''My name is Stanley''.

''He'',if a different person,was a different ''kettle of fish''.

Will post and reference,shortly.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/13/2019 03:58:20 am

I think best,Richard,at this juncture,is to refer your readers to File 4 of HEARNAP,Pages 720 - 745.

Some hoaxing ''action'' going on,during September 1974,for ''nuts'' that could be the Zodiac....including ''Mr.X'',''Your friend'',''The Christ of The Ozarks'' and ''A disciple''.

''Funniest moment'' for me,is ''The Lord God's'' ''Patty's bedroom,facing west''.

I do think though,that the typed letter of September 20th 1975,is ''most telling'',with Brigadier General Matrix,his atomic bomb,and links to Brigadier General Jack.D.Ripper,in Kubrick's ''Dr.Strangelove''....whose nickname,was ''Mein Furher'',of course.

I'm off ''to do my thing'',and find ''The Tricky Dicky'' postcard,to go along side ''The 'White' House'' one to President Nixon.

Somewhere along ''The Oregon Trail''.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/13/2019 08:24:22 am

Correction to above comment posted :

Should read, HEARNAP File 24 , Pages 720 - 745 .

Rubislaw 32 link

2/13/2019 09:30:40 am

If I might be allowed ''indulgence'',Richard,and add a comment,to your ''brave'' and forward thinking site [?].

This comment,specifically aimed at ''the authorities'' for the shameful and disgraceful way,that they have behaved,to members of the public,in the last four years.

The very people that they have been entrusted to serve.

Special investigator,Robert Mueller,is about to wind down his present role,of examining the real reason for Mr.Trump's firing of ex-Director of the FBI,James Comey.Mueller is expected to publish an official report,in the next month.

What is the betting that,the report will be ''inconclusive'',thereby leaving the ball,in Mr.Trump's court [?].

To ''the authorities'',I say this :

I know the reason,that gave Mr.Trump the [qualified] excuse to relieve Mr.Comey,of his duties.

In addition,I shall be informing a politician ''with conscience'',the identity of ''The Puppet Master'',and the man employed as ''The Fixer''.

Though all concerned,have worked for a ''greater good'',it does not give them the right to play ''God'' over honest people's lives.

Particularly those,bereaved of victims of serious crime.

To ''the authorities'',the shame is all yours.You believe that ''justice'' is yours,for the taking of,and use it as a tool to serve your own ends.

You do not respect its purpose,and have no faith in its spirit.

You,''the authorities'',are lost,and may the people have mercy on your souls.

2/13/2019 04:18:13 pm

The Zodiac Killer - YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/user/NinjaChrist1

though not complete correct - there are some good ideas here

Rubislaw 32 link

2/14/2019 10:39:05 am

Just returning to the Benicia High School note,allusions on a sample reference basis...simply start mounting up :

''..gona do my thing...'' = The Dripping Pen Card.

''....gona...'' = Channel 9 letter,when ''gonna'' is the norm

''...about time to die..'' = Bates Confession Letter.

''....sould...'' = As opposed to ''should'' - Montecello/Pines Cards - Sought/Shought.

''....22 of Dec...'' = Anniversary of Melvin Belli Letter.

''Lake Herman Road'' = Zodiac's first official murders.

'' ....dog...'' = DOJ,Department of Justice

''.....Byson...'' = '' By Son '' or '' Bay Son '' [Bayou] or '' Sans Son '' [without his,in French].

''...Qir..'' Queer [Grant],,,link with the Iran earthquake,of that year.Plus Mullins murder link to ''A Clockwork Orange''.

....This Benicia High School Note is either Zodiac,or someone that had a far greater knowledge of the Zodiac case,than a ''just'' a hoaxer.

Even a policeman would be most unlikely to know all this information,to fabricate a Zodiac correspondence.

If it was a ''hoax'',it would have to have come from the CA DOJ or FBI,themselves....and,there was just simply,and unrealistically ''not'' enough ''at stake'',to feel that an extra correspondence,faked,would make a difference to the case,in some meaningful way.

''In the real world'',either the note is Zodiac....or a co-conspirator,of some description.

And remember,that William Grant is ''innocent'' as being responsible,for any crimes,attributed to the Zodiac...as far as the FBI and CA DOJ,are concerned.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/14/2019 10:58:16 am

If one is persuaded that William J Grant was the ''victim'' of persecution,and part impersonation,by the Real Zodiac [...with the ''impersonation'' expanded to areas,such as the JFK Vallejo and Civic Fairfied Libraries...],then :

One wonders just ''when'' did the penny drop,for Grant ?

It may have been,as quickly as shortly after the Lake Herman Road murders [?].With all the ''unwelcome'' attention he was receiving,from the Benicia Police,for example.

Then,six months later,the murder of Darlene Ferrin....and the ''unwelcome'' attention from the Vallejo Police...as well renewed unwelcome attention,from the Benicia Police.

William J Grant - A Saint or a Sinner ?

The ''quantity'' of murder victims,that could have been avoided [?].

The mind truly boggles.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/14/2019 02:09:52 pm

With reference to my comments above,and for some readers,that might be,so far,unaware :

A ''Grant Imposter'' gave Grant's personal details to the JFK Library,in Vallejo,in order to take out a double LP of The Mikado.on February 5th 1968.

The same ''Grant Imposter'' gave Grant's personal details to the Civic Library,in Fairfield,in order to take out a copy of David Kahn's ''The Code Breakers'',on February 13th 1968.

This two ''events'' took place,nine months ''before'' the Lake Herman Road murders.

''Planning'',perhaps,of nefarious intentions ''well before'' most people's observations,in retrospect [?].

And,if it is the case that,William J Grant,was part of the Zodiac's plans....and was,indeed,the original ''object'' of the Zodiac's ''exercise''....then Grant may have been receiving ''stealthful'' attention....''well'' before,even the murders of David Faraday and Betty Lou Jensen.

Even,the young couple's murder,might have been avoided,if Grant had reported being the recipient of persecution....or at least,''strange happenings'',during the main part of 1968 [?].

It may have been,minor things,like noticing that someone was rifling through his garbage cans.Or,notes and phone calls.Or,visible stalking.

But,something may well have been awry to Grant,a long time before '' The sh*t hit the fan ''.

My Name Is Mine

2/14/2019 02:54:35 pm

Hi Rubislaw, I gather the library cards that provide this evidence were copied, and if so, are you aware of any copies? How do we know it was a Grant imposter who took out the books and not Grant himself? We do know that Grant had a love of such things as opera and he was a trained cryptographer. However, it makes me wonder why a trained cryptographer would require a "general reference" history of code-breaking from a small, provincial library. So, in this case, it does seem logical to presume the books were taken out by an imposter, or someone whose name was coincidentally William Grant? Grant does seem like a fairly common name, but, as you suggest, these two books do have a direct co-relation with the case, which seems more than just coincidence.

My Name Is Mine

2/14/2019 03:40:14 pm

Rubislaw, I have some more questions. Was the full name "William Joseph Grant" given by the man when he joined and does this full name appear on the typed cards? Secondly, I have read elsewhere that whenever the man signed, he evidently used a different Christian name to "William". Do you know what Christian name(s) the man signed with?

Rubislaw 32 link

2/14/2019 04:17:06 pm

I have been trying to find out,the precise name,that the library imposter employed,for his signature.

I believe that,only ''Jerry Johnson'',who was Lafferty's confident,might know.

My guess,is that the imposter employed '' Ulysses S Grant '',since there are some grounds to suggest that ''Zodiac'' had a ''thing'' about ''Robert E Lee''.

The two main adversaries,associated with the American Civil War.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/14/2019 03:35:41 pm

Good points made MNIM.

Grant,of course,had had some training in cryptography,and presumably,would have had little interest in Kahn's book.

He had lived in that area,ever since WW2,after being transferred to the Travis Airbase,at the end of his stint in the Army Air Force.In all those years,he had never had the inclination to use any local libraries....hence,the details given by his ''imposter'',required being typed out ,by both librarians as,effectively,a new user.

The imposter had to sign for this newly given information....and in both cases,signed XXXXX Grant.

This only became apparent when Lyndon Lafferty uncovered this information,as a sleuth,''sniffing around''.

Lafferty,with both libraries in agreement,handed the library cards,over to the FBI,who also to possession of the double LP and book.

In keeping with Lafferty's curiosity,though,he took the signatures to a handwriting expert,first.The expert concluded that the signatures did not match Grant's handwriting.

In honesty,and with a certain surprise,both librarians and Lafferty admitted that they did not have an explanation for this anomaly....apart from the ''imposter'' scenario.

My Name Is Mine

2/14/2019 09:28:29 pm

You've got my mind racing on this topic Rubislaw, because I have for many years believed the Zodiac was most likely in the Air Force and that he most likely came out of Travis AB. Does anybody know in which year Grant left the Army/Air Force?

Rubislaw 32 link

2/15/2019 06:11:38 am

Just on memory,though there is some documentation generally available,I think Grant was officially discharged in October 1945,MNIM.

Grant had originally moved down to EL Paso,TX,for training as a Radio Op. with Bomber Aircraft.Then,when his squadron were sent out to Australia,Grant ''copped an easy number'' by staying behind,and training as an Air Cadets instructor,in San Antonio.

When the war,in the Far East,looked winnable,Grant was sent out to The Philippines,to rejoin his unit.At that point,Grant ''conveniently'' fell down with Malaria,and was hospitalised,until close to his discharge.

During WW2,Travis Airbase was largely used as an airfreight shipment base,to support the war,in the Far East.So,Grant was probably given ''light duties'' there,before his actual discharge.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/14/2019 04:07:03 pm

If there is a ''crumb'' of mitigation for Grant's ''inferred'' behaviour,given the scenario that I have outlined,then it is that....

Circa 1968,Grant returned briefly to his hometown in Manchester,MA,to assist his elderly mother,to make the journey across The States,and move in,with him and his wife,Marian.

Grant's mother would have been living with him and Marian,by the time of the LHR murders.I believe that his mother lived on,until 1976.

In August 1976,Grant and Marian moved out of their Cordelia Road property,and found somewhere smaller,nearby.

So,perhaps Grant,at the back of his mind,''factored'' a few things,into his thinking [?].Including his reluctance to upset his mother.

2/14/2019 05:39:55 pm

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/William+Richardson+Memorial/@37.794579,-122.4063727,3a,15y,270.56h,88.42t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCQM0NwqieoyQUVUN7LnCrg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m5!3m4!1s0x8085808b50576231:0x11aa6abc069c0220!8m2!3d37.7946352!4d-122.4065372

This plaque is next to Washington St. on the first street built (Grant) and the first house (Casa Grande) ever built in San Francisco 1835 by William Richardson - just a few blocks up the Dragon's Plaza from the Dragon's Gate on Bush and Grant streets. Dedicated in 1970. Is this the Cosmic Egg (symbol representation of the birthplace) from which all things are born when it is cracked open. The Zodiac said crack it and you will have me. Was the Zodiac referring to this notion?
Mountains are most often considered axis mundis Mount Fuji and Mount Olympus to name a few. In this case Mt. Diablo.
William J Grant, aka. Bill J Grant Date of Birth March 6, 1920 was a member of " DIABLO NUMISMATIC SOCIETY”
The person that goes by Zamantha said - Grant had a view from his backyard of Mt. Diablo, during the Z days on Cordelia Road. Peeking through the Pines on his property.
With everything on Grant now mounting. And there's the matter of February 5th and 13th of 1968 library events. The idea of Grant not being the #1 POI in the case is now very, very, questionable.
At the time of the Zodiac murders Grant lived in Suisun City, 17 miles from Vallejo.
Also, later Fairfield which is 17 miles from Vallejo, and which is 32 miles from San Francisco.
The Radian line more accurate goes straight from Mt. Diablo west on Washington crossing Grant through to Maple.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/15/2019 05:41:50 am

Thanks for some extra information,BB.

I have,in the past done a fair amount of research on Grant....who is a ''difficult one'' to entirely pin down...such was his desire,to be a private person.I didn't know about the Numismatic society....I never had him down,previously,as a ''collector'' of anything.

I have the impression,over about seven years working on the case,specifically [...three years prior,working on a single murder,related...],that Grant has,as you intimate,always been the ''real'' No.1 POI.with the authorities.

The reason being,that they have always been convinced that Grant was a victim of Zodiac's persecution.

In effect,based on a philosophy of what they,the authorities actually did know,the way to find Zodiac's identity,was always going to be [...unless ''sheer luck'',from elsewhere...] through Grant.

How extraordinarily ironic,then,that the Vallejo Police,go and mess things up,by being successfully sued by Grant,for police harassment [?].Thereby ''The Law'' preventing ''Law Enforcement'' from ever making approaches to William J Grant,again.In effect,''LE's'' main source of exposing the Zodiac.

This,of course,was what [..I believe..] Lyndon Lafferty failed to appreciate....seeing as he,Lyndon,thought that Grant was Zodiac.

I have a lot of disdain for ''LE'',in this respect.Lafferty did much fine work,as an amateur investigator...but failed to realise that,''LE'' were using him,to an extent.

LE allowed Lafferty,to continue thinking that Grant was Zodiac,in order to acquire more information on Grant,from Lafferty.

LE hung on to Lafferty's coat tails.....and should be ashamed of themselves,for not making this,transparent to Lafferty.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/15/2019 06:52:41 am

To further add,BB,with respect to your mention of ''...crack it and then you will have me.''

This takes us to up to 1988,and the ''unconfirmed'' two New Canaan Letters.Including,of course,Z263.

I may be the only one,for all I know,but these letters are ''undoubtedly'' the work of the Zodiac,and sent to George Webster,father of Harvard post-graduate student,Joan.

Joan Webster went missing,after meeting a man,at Logan Airport,in late 1981.Her body would not be discovered,until April 1990,in woodland,at Hamilton,MA.

If you type up ''Joan Webster's bearded man'' for Google images,you will see the composite of a man,whom I believe looks like the Zodiac,in 1981.

With Ms.Webster's body finally emerging in 1990,I can't help thinking that,this could have been,in part,the influence for the Zodiac sending the Celebrity Cipher and Eureka Card,in September and December,of that [1990] year.

Sent,I believe,with a certain sentimentality and Paul Avery,in mind.

My Name Is Mine

2/15/2019 04:00:16 pm

Rubislaw, the New Canaan letters were a hoax perpetrated by a bored high school student. The letter writer merely rehashed things from Graysmith's book and used the same key code for the cipher and tacked in the names of two well-known local identities for comic effect. I have already commented on it elsewhere, but will repeat as follows.

Thanks to a few of my sources, it appears the 1998 New Canaan letter was dismissed by the FBI as a hoax. Apparently it was just some rich kid with too much time on his hands playing a practical joke. The same can be said for the Secret Pal snowman card and photocopied keys that keeps re-surfacing all over the net. That one was sent by a different hoaxer who ironically called himself "Sam". Sam was a resident of Eureka. The keys he photocopied were in fact his own post office box keys!

As for the New Canaan hoax, the person named Shauna in the letter was a real person. She is an opera singer who attended New Canaan school. She is still alive and well.

As for Mrs Taylor, the surname Taylor is very common in New Canaan. A “Mrs. Taylor”, known to her friends as Dody, lived in New Canaan from 1952 until 1997, before moving to a nearby town. She was a well known local artist. It is interesting that she left New Canaan the year before the hoax letter was posted.

I have heard some claims that a Mrs Taylor was also a school teacher at New Canaan - she was perhaps the same person as the artist - but I cannot confirm this.

But it’s clear this New Canaan communication was just a hoax. The hoaxer used basically the same code as the 408 to encrypt the message. Some school kid with wealthy parents had evidently decided to re-hash the Zodiac stuff and added a couple of local female identities to the mix.

I wonder if he got into trouble? Perhaps a case of “Boys will be boys!” At least Sam from Eureka did not seem too bothered by the fuss his little hoax had caused. Both efforts were rather juvenile in their intent.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/15/2019 07:44:10 pm

Thanks for your feedback on Z263,MNIN.

What you have conveyed,is ''hearsay'',and ''gossip'' and ''Chinese Whispers''.

The FBI Cryptanalysis Unit and myself,know different from everything that you have tried to convey.

This will become apparent,as well as other misrepresentations and misconceptions regarding many of the ciphers,either carrying confirmed or unconfirmed status.

Someone recently,simply stated that the FBI don't communicate with anyone,anyway,over the the ciphers.

That is not true either.

In time,all will become apparent,including the affect that one cipher solution has had on a senior policeman's career.

However,unlike the Zodiac himself,his ciphers have yet to kill anyone.

Fingers crossed.

My Name Is Mine

2/15/2019 11:45:39 pm

It is not hearsay and conjecture Rubislaw. But nevertheless I bow to your greater wisdom and remain to be enthralled by the ultimate revelation, when it happens! By the way, thank you for confirming the possible dates for Grant's service years and retirement. Cheers!

2/15/2019 12:20:26 pm

https://www.google.com/search?q=Joan+Webster%27s+bearded+man&tbm=isch&source=hp&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjxpeWysL7gAhVJwVQKHYq9ApoQ7Al6BAgCEBM&biw=1240&bih=656#imgdii=6udK-EtJCwHhVM:&imgrc=bp4kVY1SHCbavM:

Your two pictures of Joan Webster's bearded man look like these two pictures also on your site.

http://zodiackillermystery.freeforums.net/thread/212/speculations-regarding-officer

Rubislaw 32 - Are you insinuating that Grant could be the patsy - set up to cover for him?
I saw a list of the spelling errors of his and the Zodiac - and they are the same.
Also, his being a plain clothes detective assigned to the juvenile division would explain his
disdain for teenagers. He was not in homicide yet I see a picture of him next to a dead body.
And, detectives drove unmarked sedans which look like the vehicle described at BRS.

Tom1

2/16/2019 12:10:04 pm

Sorry BB, but you got me on this one. I know I'm a little slow, but are you linking the Joan Webster case to a Vallejo PD detective?

It Was "Him"

2/16/2019 01:50:22 pm

Tom -- You should not worry too much about it. BB is just throwing ideas out there.

There are plenty of similar theories in existence, e.g. Officer Hal Snook, Detective Mulanax, Donald Fouke. There is even one for Donald Harden, Bryan Hartnell, and I am sure, Detective Toschi.

Whether you choose to believe in any one of them depends largely on which garden path you are prepared to go down. You may prefer to follow your own path. I always do. You can often stay well clear of the pit holes and if you still manage to fall into one, well it is your own pit hole to climb out of, and you are not simply filling it for someone else.

2/16/2019 02:42:51 pm

Tom1 - I was asked my opinion on the first 2 pics, and I gave 2 pics that match close.

Have you ever read the zresearch idea? I think it's worthy of testing.

http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=3570

zresearch points out several lies Dick tells. Peace be with you my friend.

It was "Him" link

2/16/2019 02:57:31 pm

Oh and add Richard Hoffman to the "little list" of potential villains already named.

2/16/2019 04:55:06 pm

As it goes the only thing preventing everyone from considering Dick is a two minute gap in the time line 12:38 death pronounced. And, the 12:40 phone call - if average walking pace is just 4 minutes. Why couldn't he simply run?

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/38.1031475,-122.2381705/38.1061289,-122.2381406/@38.1045542,-122.2404124,17z/data=!4m2!4m1!3e2

Rubislaw 32 link

2/15/2019 02:21:54 pm

Just to be clear,''The Bearded Man'' which has been attached,to a policeman,in some presentations,is misleading.

The composite of ''The Bearded Man'' should be judged,on its own merit,and has nothing to do with the police,on a suspicion of Joan Webster's killer,basis.

And,to be clear about Grant,all indications are that Grant was not responsible for any of Zodiac's crimes.Grant was the victim of Zodiac's persecution....and as such,is likely to have known the Zodiac's identity.

Zodiac's primary goal,was to make Grant's life,a living hell,out of spite...and cottoned on to the idea,of killing a couple,and pin it on Grant [LHR].But,when this didn't work,and,Zodiac felt the need to kill Darlene....Zodiac then decided to declare himself,as ''The Zodiac'',a serial killer,who also extorted.

Darlene ''had to die'' because she was not giving the man,that we know as Zodiac,clear enough indications of a secret that she held.That secret was,that she knew why ''Zodiac'' was persecuting Grant.And,when it became apparent that Grant was being suspected as responsible for LHR....then ''Zodiac'' surmised that Darlene would realise that it was actually him,Zodiac,that killed David and Betty Lou.

The inference being,of course,that Darlene and ''Zodiac'' knew each other....which the did,going back,a few years.

The one thing I am unable to divulge,at present,is the reason why ''Zodiac'' elected to persecute Grant....the ''crux'' of the case,the ''precipitater'',and which constitutes core motive of The Zodiac.

This will become evident when ''Zodiac'' is [hopefully] prosecuted.

It is this information that cost Darlene her life.It is this same information,that gave Marian Grant a nervous breakdown.

And it is I,who in 2012,shortly after Grant's natural death,became only the third person,to find out.

Hopefully soon,everyone will know.

2/15/2019 04:13:17 pm

WOW

Tom1

2/17/2019 07:20:32 am

What are the chances that Lafferty actually came face to face with the imposter, but was not aware that there was an imposter?

Rubislaw 32 link

2/17/2019 10:43:20 am

About 100%.

All indications are,from Lafferty's perspective,is that he,Lafferty,was being persecuted,in his capacity of a highway cop,by the terms of engagement of ''cat and mouse''.

When the well known ''incident'' occurred,Lafferty had already logged car details,from a distance,and assumed that he would be dealing with Grant.

Documentation suggests that Grant had picked up a few traffic violation tickets,in the past,for minor misdemeanours,but there is no evidence that,and at 49 years old,Grant had suddenly turned into a ''boy racer''.

But that was lost on Lafferty.His ''experience'' seems to have allowed him to convince himself,that he had ''starred into the face of death''.

Incorrectly,a face belonging to Grant.Lafferty was aware of what Grant looked like,locally.So,it appears that the imposter,as well as the imposter's car,looked like Grant.....to Lafferty.

My Name Is Mine

2/17/2019 01:44:33 pm

Mysteries upon mysteries! He got close enough to the man to look into the face of death... but as a "trained, professional" police officer, for some reason, he totally neglected to look at the car's number plate! That must have been one truly shocking face!!!

FAIL!

My Name Is Mine

2/15/2019 06:43:58 pm

The Bearded Man scenario potentially leads everywhere. Some have taken it all the way to Canada.

A Canadian man named Henning Lagie was a more recent suspect in the Zodiac case. I am not sure of the complete story, but it seems Lagie was living in California during the Zodiac era. He then moved to Canada at the same time as the Zodiac fell silent. An amateur sleuth named Melody Wall was pushing this case for a few years, but has been silent on the topic since at least 2017.

Henning Lagie lived in Germany during WWII. As a child it was said that he use to kick around human skulls for fun. He was terribly abused by his mother, beaten and locked in a cold, dark cellar for days with no food. His father did nothing to help him. The family immigrated to the United States and lived in California. His brother was still living in California, at least around 2012. Henning moved to Canada at the same time Zodiac disappeared. Almost immediately killings started to occur in the 100 Milehouse area where he lived, and along the, “Highway of Tears”, a notorious section of the Cariboo Highway. A home that Henning co-owned with his father was 108 Mile Ranch which is located along this same section of the Cariboo Highway.

There have been numerous abductions and murders of women in that vicinity and along the nearby highways. The same culprit may be responsible for the abductions and murders of Native American children in Canada.

Lagie wore a watch similar to the one that was left at the scene of Cheri Jo Bates murder in Riverside. Also, when Riverside detectives staged a re-enactment of the crime scene, the only two things missing were the bearded man, who witnesses had observed in the library on the night in question, and the car that the killer was believed to have parked nearby, which witnesses had also seen.

I do not know if Lagie is still alive. He was in his 90s when he was first mentioned by Melody Wall. His facial features are a good match for the composite, including the age progression composite of the Zodiac suspect seen at and leaving the Stine murder.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/16/2019 05:43:32 am

That's interesting information on Henning Lagie,MNIM.

Good to get some feedback from you and BB,on this composite.

Its circumstances are that Joan and The Bearded Man,met up in ''baggage retrieval'' and exited Logan Air terminal looking for a taxi.

They both had large suitcases,implying that they had both arrived,by air....though probably on different planes.

When finding a taxi,The Bearded Man had an altercation with the driver,after it became apparent that,the two cases would not fit into his cab's boot.The couple then proceeded to look elsewhere,for another taxi.

The composite was constructed,largely on the ''rejected'' cabbie's description...which was,at close quarters.

This composite has only been available to the public,for about the last 3 years.It was eventually handed over to Eve Carson,sister-in-law of Joan.

It transpires that,when the composite was first compiled,George Webster did not want it being publicly circulated,as a ''wanted'' poster.

Eve Carson criticises her ex-father-in-law,George,for this decision.

I believe that Ms.Carson is wrong to criticise,Joan had only recently gone missing.There was every chance that she had been kidnapped,and that her abductor might make contact,with a ransom demand.

If the ''abductor'' knew that a flyer,with his likeness,was in circulation,then it might make him decide to kill Joan.

As it transpires,Joan's abductor probably had already murdered Joan.And,it is this ''likeness'' of The Bearded Man,whom we are left with.

George and Eleanor Webster were to go on to receive cards,letters and phone calls,in relation to their daughter's disappearance,in the years,after 1981.

With a number of pages,in the FBI Zodiac Files,alone,devoted to Joan's case,one wonders whether the Zodiac was responsible for her death and/or extortion related to her disappearance.

Hence,the composite of The Bearded Man,has become a ''possible'' picture of the Zodiac,ten or so years on,from his Bay Area reign of terror.

Gyke Schmike!

2/16/2019 12:29:41 am

Dear Rubislaw,

I have been following your correspondence on this forum for some time and I must say I am very confused. In some posts you write about the FBI and L.E. as some kind of nefarious entity that is responsible for perpetrating an obscure and elaborate conspiracy. You write as though their dealings of the Zodiac case were not entirely scrupulous and underhanded. You write as though some senior cops got together and manufactured an outcome, or a lack of one.

You also mention things like FBI files being pulled as fast as you report on them, and your internet connection dropping out and being unable to log back in at times... and I have even heard you report that you have been a victim of anonymous phone calls, and so on and so forth... But I have gone straight to the FBI archives and found the same files that you claim have been "pulled" in just a few seconds. So this is the first thing that confuses me.

The second thing is that you write in other posts about the FBI as if you are on some kind of "intimate" speaking terms with them and they are like your "peers", although you do often seem conveniently evasive when it comes to providing any proof of your intimate "co-operative relationship" with the FBI and their CryptoAnalysis Unit. Also this friendly and welcoming attitude on the part of the FBI seems to only involve you and nobody else.

You write as if you are in possession of secret "Insider" news that you are not privy to discuss with the rest of we mere mortals, on what is essentially just a public online forum owned and moderated by a guy called Richard from Coventry.

Forgive me when I say this, but whenever people say they are sharing insights with the FBI and/or members of L.E., I always consider such testimony with a huge helping of salt. The thing is, a great many other people have made similar claims as yourself over the years and decades and we have all been let down badly by their mischief.

So please, can you tell us why we should trust you?

Where is the proof that you have any kind of relationship with the FBI? Please, send the proof to Richard and I am sure he will publish it.

But of course, I suspect this is not possible, because the relationship is covert and therefore secret and you are only allowed to provide us with mere snippets of mostly obscure information? Plus Richard is taking a break, thereby giving you another convenient excuse.

What I am suggesting is if you are telling us the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, you should be able to provide some proof of your claims. At present, because I find no evidence of files being pulled at all, I can only make presumptions on the provability of your other claims.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/16/2019 04:02:56 am

Gosh,Gyke Schmike....you do ask a lot of me,all in the one go......but I commend the way you have asked....and understand your curiosity.

I always attempt to discuss,debate and share aspects of the case,or ''The Zodiac'',as a phenomenon.But,inevitably ''extra'' elements that are pertinent,come up,which result in additional curiosity from fellow contributors....and do,to an extent require further qualification.

But,there has to be a line drawn,somewhere,when for instance,a further piece of information,might actually harm what Law Enforcement are hoping to achieve.

But yes,also,Law Enforcement have a habit of ''taking all'',and giving nothing in return.And,it is only at a later date,one realises that one's information has been used,for less than ''honourable'' purposes.

A case in point :

About three years ago,I was busily compiling information,and handing it over to ''two'' murder re-investigation teams of hand picked detectives assigned to two separate murders.Both of these murders might be Zodiac related.

The public were/are unaware of the link....not least,that the two murders,themselves,might be linked.But the teams and I,dealt with my information,as if it was a given,that the two murders are related.

Shortly after,I am confronted by the sight,on live TV,of an appointed assurance reviewer of the police,walk in to a Justice Committee hearing,and lie,bare faced,to politicians on this point of more than one murder.

Such times,as that referred,and the way that Departments of Justice withhold information,from the bereaved,on their lost love ones....or indeed,plain ignore some bereaved,for sometimes years at a time....can make one angry,and desire to tell the world,everything ''you'' know.

So,at sites such as Richard's,one has to find that boundary,between responsible thinking,and generosity of debate.And,hopefully,as time goes on,with perhaps extra things happening to the Zodiac case....then one can offer even more information.

Specifically,in the last 4 years,my dealings have been with 2 politicians,an ex-watchdog police committee member,2 newspaper editors,2 branches of a major police force,1 Department of Justice,through a liaison police officer,the FBI Cryptanalysis Unit,and NCIS Washington.

To start ''producing evidence'' of this,would be just trite [?].

What I state,I mean,and can be held accountable for,at a later date.

On this matter,I can't offer much more..save to say that,the FBI have more cipher information....and indeed,Zodiac related forensics material....than most people that take an interest....might imagine.

Gyke Schmike!

2/16/2019 05:00:32 am

I will look forward to seeing the movie when you become famous!

Rubislaw 32 link

2/16/2019 11:18:46 am

Thanks Gyke Schmike....and I take the generosity of your proposal,in the genuine spirit,that is intended.

Noting Mr.MNIM's comments below,a coincidence is that Mr.Trump is actually a registered neighbour of mine,owning an seaside estate,''just up the road'' from where I live.He used to jet in,once a month,to play golf,and keep up good public relations,with the locals.

We don't see so much of him these days,and gather that he is a busy man.

And,if we want to play golf on his course,we have to stump up $300 for a single round of 18 holes.

Apparently,he is in need of financing,to build a wall.

Gyke Schmike!

2/16/2019 01:34:14 pm

Of course these days Trump is too busy ratting out "fake news" and replacing it with his own "much clearer and more factual" versions via Twitter.

Consequentially, he can always blame the opposition and the FBI when things go wrong. Oh my! How uncanny is that?

https://youtu.be/BKaQLYPf5hM?t=39

My Name Is Mine

2/16/2019 06:01:28 am

I am willing to buy that there is evidence to suggest Grant was somehow involved in the Zodiac case, but I find anything beyond that (of the magnitude that Rubislaw proposes) to be plausible, but also a bit of a leap into the dark.

As for the "buddy network" between himself and the FBI and NCIS and the like, well that speaks for itself. I personally went golfing with Donald Trump yesterday and we discussed the Zodiac case at some length, in between frequent interruptions to do with national emergencies and building a wall to stop invading Mexicans etc.. But of course I am not obliged to speak about it and if you contact his office they will deny any knowledge that I was ever there. So you will just have to trust me on that. Suffice to say when the case s solved you will all hear about it then. Cheers! :)

Tom1

2/16/2019 01:12:18 pm

So true. It is one thing to claim to have inside dope, and not be able to reveal it, and quite another to criticize others on the outside for their honest opinions based on their personal experiences.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/18/2019 08:53:45 pm

As referred in this comments section,previously,I have Z38 down,as the cipher where the Zodiac ''lets rip'' at ''Bill Grant''.

On record,I contend that the Zodiac,accuses Mr.Grant of being :

i ] A libidinous ''Stage Yankee''.

ii ] An ''A**hole''.

iii ] Living a ''Blank staring'',immature and ''Part time'' life.

This would have been in December 1969...a year after LHR,and accounting for the lives,that we know about,of David Faraday,Betty Lou Jensen,Darlene Ferrin,Cecelia Shepard and Paul Stine.

My Name Is Mine

2/19/2019 12:08:32 am

Those smaller ciphers are great. We can force them to mean whatever we want in order to fit our pet suspect or theory. Furthermore we can safely claim that we are certain our solution is exactly what the Zodiac intended, because in the absence of the Zodiac himself, there is really no way for anybody to prove the unprovable.

Rubislaw 32 link

2/19/2019 02:11:26 am

The ''small ciphers'' are neither great,nor minor,MNIM.

Any of the ''ciphers'' [...for they are all,actually cryptograms..],have equal potential,in importance.This depends on what information the solutions,contain.

We ? On this matter,I,if alone or with others,do not agree with you.

Perhaps,it is because of the nature of my relationship with the FBI's Cryptanalysis Unit,and the wider ramifications of some of the ''cipher'' solutions.

Perhaps you have not been entertained in the same way,by the Unit,because your inabilities have precluded you,from having any relationship,with them [?].

And,that some of the ''ciphers'' are actually provable,beyond the realms of realistic probability.

And,further to this,that like the Hardens,one doesn't necessarily have had to have had,a specific type of education.to achieve some of the solutions.

For some of us,the ''Software Package'' is more akin to that which holds items,such as woolly socks or men's briefs.Certainly of no use at all,in attempting decryption of cryptograms or assessing the function of cipher keys.

Like the Hardens,the only way to succeed is focus and hard graft.In their case,crossword puzzles helped.

In my case,as a trained and qualified mathematician.The ''gift'' could still come from somewhere else,though.

But,''not'' with the assistance of machines of computation.

Only,the human brain,itself.

My Name Is Mine

2/19/2019 03:22:19 am

You are a funny guy! You find a beach with a billion grains of sand. You pick out one and tell everybody you have found the only diamond on the beach. As I have already said there is no way for anybody to prove the unprovable, just as there is no way for any of us to know if you seriously believe the things you say or if you are simply writing in jest, or if this is just some kind of idle boasting, or if there is some other explanation. The diamond you hold may simply be a grain of sand. With a chance of many billions to one I know which one is most likely. Do you seriously believe that you hold the definitive solution to that cipher, precisely the way the Zodiac intended it? The clever use of words to legitimize your solution and cast doubt at those who call you out at your little game can only get you so far. It gets to the point of being akin to a flat earther or a global warming denier, who believes in something that defies science and common simple logic.

3/2/2019 09:31:36 am

Mr. William Shakespeare's Comedies, Histories, & Tragedies is the 1623 published collection of William Shakespeare's plays. Modern scholars commonly refer to it as the First Folio. It is considered one of the most influential books ever published in the English language. Wikipedia

The Confession Letter has 1623 individual letters in total.

3/2/2019 10:54:57 am

Richard

A good reason why we should eliminate Ross Sullivan as having anything to do with this case.
According to http://www.zodiackiller.com/SR2.html [we see the watch found at the CJB
scene has a wrist size of 7" worn into the band - if Ross had a size 8'' wrist then why is he still
a suspect? Unless known to be part of a conspiracy - don't you think he should be eliminated as
a suspect?] Not to mention, the definite pointing to the name William over, and over in the
correspondences opposed to the reference to the name Sullivan. Should he be allowed to RIP?

Rubislaw 32 link

3/3/2019 01:32:15 am

Interesting,BB,your ruminations on the Cheri Jo Bates case.

As much a mystery,who killed Cheri Jo,as who was responsible for the Bay Area attacks.With a marginal ''over spill'' possibility that it was the same man.

What I have considered recently is,how it is that,as reflected in the Zodiac FBI files....that the FBI devoted 8 years of their time,on the Cheri Jo Bates case,from ''behind a desk'',since they were not permitted to,legally and openly,investigate the case,themselves.

''Not for nothing'',one might reason [?]....and the obvious conclusion is,that the FBI were certain of,at least,the Zodiac's ''extortion'' involvement,with the Riverside murder.

I understand,all to well,that those ''entering the Zodiac arena'' as amateur sleuths,will want to have a figurative ''look around'' at suspects and victims.

Also,that William Grant does not represent compelling reasons,for being the Zodiac,himself.

But,what I do suggest is,that Grant was,undoubtedly,a ''living victim'' of the Zodiac,and therefore,''more than probably'' remains the only person,for whom,is able to lead us to the Zodiac's identity.

So yes....everyone ought to have a look around.But,to dismiss this compelling reasoning,that Grant knew Zodiac,and it will continually come back to haunt one.

In addition,that Darlene Ferrin knew ''why'' the Zodiac was persecuting Grant.

But,that is yet another operetta,in the rich tapestry of this legendary tale.

3/3/2019 09:20:03 am

William Lee Suff is the Zodiac?

Bill did do what the Confession letter states;

"I shall cut off her female parts and deposit them for the whole city to see."

He did cut off female parts. And display them on a fence for the city to see.
He liked to impersonate police officers.
He did serve in the military.
He is a serial killer.
He is a William.

So, why do "the powers that be" want everyone to think William Grant is the Zodiac?
Yet, at the same time they tell us that Grant is not the Zodiac. And, they say he is un-investigate-able. None of which makes any sense. Why do they have the case rendered cold when it is not. Because, they don't want it to go any further?. In Grant is the the perfect patsy. He is to blame. But, he is not investigate-able. Yet, he is nobody. Why?
Is it a cover - up?

Mt Name Is Mine

3/3/2019 02:42:13 pm

How do you place him there BB?

William Suff was still in high school in Texas in 1966.

He only moved to Riverside in 1986, a full 20 years after Cheri Jo Bates was murdered.

Richard

3/3/2019 02:57:56 pm

He was born in Torrance, California.
'William Lester Suff, 41--a local boy still remembered by schoolmates and teachers in the Riverside area--has been charged in two of the grisly murders. Authorities say they are confident of linking Suff to a majority of the 19 murders of women, mostly prostitutes and drug users, whose bodies had been dumped in this semirural community and elsewhere in western Riverside County. Every victim was stabbed or strangled or both, according to new details, and three of the recent bodies were mutilated--a breast cut off each.' Los Angeles Times. 1992.

Richard

3/3/2019 03:04:11 pm

Graduated from Perris High School in 1968.

http://maamodt.asp.radford.edu/Psyc%20405/serial%20killers/Suff,%20William%20-%202005.pdf

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Terracina+Drive,+Riverside,+CA,+USA/Perris+Union+High+School+District,+CA,+USA/@33.8458724,-117.3211083,11z/data=!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x80dcb1eaed4a8269:0x9b9c74b502b63c07!2m2!1d-117.3826128!2d33.971788!1m5!1m1!1s0x80dc9e2e4c517bf5:0x330d49f7292060af!2m2!1d-117.1970557!2d33.7254012!3e0

My Name Is Mine

3/3/2019 04:19:11 pm

I stand corrected Richard. I had always assumed from the link you provided that the school was the Perris High School in Texas, but evidently the school he attended was actually "Perris Union State High School", 155 E 4th St, Perris, CA 92570, USA. Thanks for the heads up on this!

Still he seems a long shot for Cheri Jo to me. His MO just doesn't seem right. Is their any other history of William Suff writing letters to the press and the cops or victim's families? If so, what does his handwriting look like?

My Name Is Mine

3/3/2019 04:26:32 pm

Ha! I only needed to take one look at Suff's handwriting to rule him out as the Zodiac. However he could be a potential suspect in Cheri Jo Bate's murder, I will grant you that, even though the MO is way off. Seems an unlikely suspect to me.

Rubislaw 32 link

3/3/2019 06:11:03 pm

You articulate you frustrations,very well,BB,and I am confident that the whole truth will eventually emerge....if that is any consolation,for you,in the ''now''.

The ''powers that be'' don't care what we think,and are not prepared to assist us,in thinking ''anything'',while there is still chance of a resolve,to this case.

The case has never definitively been cold,though has seen periods of ''cold storage''.

Strangely,it is a ''strength'' of the legal system,that Grant won his police harassment injunction...because it was factually the case,that the police were harassing him,but unprepared to arrest him,on any charges.

Sadly,this didn't suit advancements in a resolution to the case.

In any other context,Grant would have been seen as a hero,for standing up to the Zodiac.But,I am equally confident that history will portray him as a ''coward'',who only thought about himself,when he realised the nature of the Zodiac's engagement,with him.

Not least,that he ''sat back'' and watched his beautiful,kind and vibrant wife,''fall apart'' in front of his very eyes,when he realised that he had no choice,but to tell her the truth of the matter.

The Zodiac might actually get off,quite lightly,compared to Grant,when the historians deliver their assessment.

How ''poetically warped'' is that [?].

Yes... ''No Cover-up''...but just the ''law'' refereeing itself fairly.

Lafferty just couldn't see it,because he had ''decided'' that Grant was the Zodiac.

So much unnecessary suffering....with the Vallejo Police looking ''foolish''....sadly,and perhaps unfairly,for them.

Grant was a ''victim''....and a sinner.

''Selfish'',to the core.

My Name Is Mine

3/4/2019 01:26:17 am

Rubislaw, I am sure the same could probably be said of Riverside PD's prime suspect, who they call "Bob Barnett", but this name has been varied over time on internet forums to "Bill Barnett", "Bill Bennett", "Bob Bennet", "William Bennett", and "Bill Barnet" etc. A lot of speculation existed on the internet forums, with some claiming this was the same man as Lawrence Kane, which is very doubtful. Riverside PD did at least provide sufficient details about their suspect that we can presume he attended the same class as Cheri Jo in 1966. Apparently he was a former boyfriend and the theory is that he killed Cheri Jo in a jealous rage when she told him she was to marry her fiance, Dennis Highland. However, mitochondrial DNA ruled this "Barnett" fellow out long ago. Still the Riverside PD has apparently failed to let him go, or at least are still focusing their attentions on the small "gang" of boys who, by their own admission and the word of eyewitnesses, were "hanging about" on a wall over from Cheri Jo's car.

If you follow the timeline, clearly someone was not telling the truth about places and times, otherwise there are significant time discrepancies in the witness testimonies. It does seem likely that the suspects were there at the right place and the right time and were most likely to interfere with a vehicles ignition. They would perhaps also be the most likely to lie and cover for one another, even if the case was actually that they were simply pulling a prank on Cheri Jo, and a total stranger was later responsible for her murder. Somehow I suspect the "boys" have always been the ones on PD's radar. The reason I say this is I find inconsistencies and discrepancies in the timelines as reported by the boys and the eyewitnesses. There are other time discrepancies in this case too, and I am sure that not all can be put down to people mis-reporting the correct time due to Daylight Saving. A lot of things about the circumstances that night just don't add up for me.

3/3/2019 05:04:50 pm

As investigators scrambled to find evidence, members of the media began digging into Suff's past. While his family remained tight-lipped and details of his early life remain vague, they were able to obtain several bits of information from public records. According to Keers and Lane, William Lester Suff was born on August 20, 1950, in Torrance, California. Unfortunately, when it comes to early childhood events - invariably, the most interesting pieces of the puzzle - very little is known. In regard to his siblings, Suff's brothers were also troubled, one by drugs, the other by a nagging predilection for pedophilia.

http://murderpedia.org/male.S/s/suff-william.htm

It seems the military stationed him for a while in Texas - where he killed his daughter - Suff was sentenced to 70 years in prison, but earned his parole in March 1984, after serving only 10 years. He was paroled to his home state. He went to High school in Riverside - and - just like Cheri - he was a "skillful musician". The desk was in the music room closet.
Cheri took music classes in piano. She was fairly good at playing that instrument. RH means Right Hand which is seen on music sheets and has to do with stop. A music major said.

Rubislaw 32 link

3/4/2019 04:38:57 am

I read entirely sensible suggestions,with respect to Cher Jo's murder.

Personally,I haven't got a clue who murdered her,but fairly sure that it wasn't the Zodiac.

But,I certainly care that her perpetrator will be exposed,or brought to justice,if still alive.

Reading an article about the Riverside Police,about three years ago,and,with the Bates case largely featured....I sensed that there was an atmosphere of optimism,for the future.

As if,perhaps,certain promises had been made about ''resolutions''.

Possibly for the Santa Barbara Police,also,with the Domingos/Edwards case [?].

It could be that,if justice in the Zodiac case is achieved,then a few ''ghosts from the past'',peripheral to the Zodiac case,will be extinguished,at the same time.

3/6/2019 02:36:50 pm

Richard I think you are correct about everything but we have to go over this again and again untill....
This extra Letter in "until" - to make "untill"
Also he pointed to the (ill) in Phillips
And his strange mentioning of "still"
is there anything about
hill
pill
will
kill
till
You ache to know MY NAME, and so, Ill clue you in.

Though I think the name William is a correct read, the Zodiac could also be
hinting subconsciously or subliminally influencing the jury pool about being "mentally ill".
What do you think about (Ill)? Also since his correspondence is his M.O.

Cops in and around the Zodiac with the name William should be considered.
A DNA test should at least be performed. The profile too should include all the police like
tactics and leads. Pull-over/flash light/CB radio/face down/hands restrained/planned procedures/calling it in.
Something of Bill Armstrong's should be tested - just to eliminate him as a POI.
After all his partner was "Dirty Harry"busted for faking Zodiac correspondence.
DNA tests would clear his name.

Richard

3/6/2019 03:48:35 pm

I would like to think the name is William BB, but it could also be wide of the mark, especially because I'm not sure the Exorcist letter is even Zodiac. I'm fairly certain the other three 1974 letters are not, but I'm about 50/50 on the Exorcist letter. My guess is that Zodiac wasn't a serving copper, but wouldn't rule out an former policeman. I suspect Zodiac is somebody like DeAngelo, somebody who was never mentioned in the police investigations....ever.

Richard

3/7/2019 12:57:16 pm

Betty Lou Jensen featured in the 1969 Vallejo yearbook BB. William Martin (the name I concluded as most likely in the article) featured in the class of 1958. This would have made him 26 years of age in 1968. He is listed as William (Willie) Martin.
https://old-friends.co/school.php?s=16927

Richard

3/7/2019 01:20:24 pm

The Zodiac Killer wrote "signed yours truley" on the Exorcist letter and proceeded to give us a verse from 'Tit-Willow'. It made me wonder whether he was hinting that his name was in the verse, such as "Will" or "Bill". Consequently "signed yours truley, William". Will appeared three times. The letter was a curious blend of 'The Exorcist' and 'The Mikado'. Three prominent William's were associated with these two productions, William S. Gilbert (responsible for the libretto of The Mikado), and William Friedkin and William Peter Blatty responsible for 'The Exorcist' film and book.

Bearing in mind the estimated age of the Zodiac given as between 25-45 in 1969, this would make his birth date between 1924 and 1944. So, from a statistical standpoint, I looked at the most popular boys names in the USA in the 1920s, 1930s and 1940s. William was ranked 4th highest in the 1920s with 512,400, 4th highest in the 1930s with 416,646 and 4th highest in the 1940s with 556,399.

I looked at the most popular American surnames that could possibly fit the criteria required by the '13 Symbol' cipher and the already inserted "William". Sixteenth on the list was the name Martin, giving us an estimated name of William Martin for the Zodiac Killer.

William Martin featured in the class of 1958 in the Vallejo School yearbook, meaning he was 26 years of age in 1968. But where did he live?

My Name Is Mine

3/7/2019 04:09:59 pm

Hi Richard, The solution that you present fits perfectly the criteria of a homophonic substitution that functions on the level of a simple anagram.

AEN+8K8M8VNAM

+8NN8AMMAEV8K
WILL I AMMART IN

I have always wondered about the Zodiac's use of "My Name Is". It is a rather childish phrase in many ways. In fact the phrase is repeated by high school students the world over who are learning a foreign language, French or German for example: "Mein Name ist..." and "Je m'appelle..." or "Mon nom est..."

My Name Is Mine

3/7/2019 10:30:02 pm

Richard, what page is he on in the yearbook? I can't find him. Hey, I notice Ralph Spinelli appears on page 11 in the Varsity Squad photo for that year!

Richard

3/7/2019 11:41:33 pm

https://old-friends.co/school.php?s=16927

CLASS OF 1958

Richard

3/7/2019 11:52:31 pm

"I have always wondered about the Zodiac's use of "My Name Is". It is a rather childish phrase in many ways. In fact the phrase is repeated by high school students the world"

Nice line of thought.

My Name Is Mine

3/8/2019 12:21:49 am

Still can't find him in the actual yearbook.

https://www.classmates.com/yearbooks/Vallejo-High-School/4182712091

Richard

3/8/2019 12:56:00 am

"Registered members can tag and share". Doesn't that yearbook rely on others tagging and sharing and therefore will not feature everyone?

My Name Is Mine

3/9/2019 12:44:25 am

Hi Richard, There is something strange going on with that "William (Willie) Martin" name. I am getting search hits for this name, as tagged, for the following high schools on different years. But if I check the respective Yearbooks nobody by this name can be found:

Vallejo High School

San Bernardino High School

Longview High School

Bay Shore Sr. High School

Plainfield High School

Valley Forge High School

North Miami Sr. High School

Trevor G. Browne High School

I will keep searching.

Richard

3/9/2019 02:11:17 am

That is the problem with people tagging other people. What we need is an official document or similar. It is certainly a bit suspicious!

3/7/2019 07:22:13 pm

He would be 78+ if he graduated in 1958 at 18 years old.

https://www.intelius.com/people-search/William-Martin/CA?filterMiddleInitial=&filterAge=71-80&filterCity=&filterbutton=Filter&profileid=&firstname=William&middlename=&lastname=Martin&state=&citystate=&isv2=1

Nice work as always
Keep up the spirit

Richard

3/7/2019 11:50:02 pm

If Betty Lou was 16 when she was murdered and was in the class of 69, then William Martin should have been 16 in in 1958, making him around 76 years of age.

3/8/2019 11:07:44 am

William Crow made himself out to be a tough guy - YELLING and scaring his X.
"I kept making macho statements"
He made up this story that was not proven by the forensics.
A white car that nobody else seems to see at the LHR scene.
Nothing of what he says makes any sense.
Crowing-on about being chased by two Zodiacs.
Do you think this guy is cerous?
I think he is telling a story.
If we look at it that way then
everything begins to make sense.
More info on these people would help.
We can only make just so many educated
guesses before we get into soothsaying.
But, if we through out the statements made
by Crow in stead of try to make them fit -
then things seem to look clearer.
And then we can ask why Crow would lie.
And, was his X scared of him for what this
suggests. Not for shouting and carrying-on.

My Name Is Mine

3/8/2019 03:26:51 pm

Or the Zodiac was perhaps Crow himself? I am certain if the Zodiac is ever identified he will be some totally loopy guy who nobody would have ever suspected in a million years.

Then again, there have been so many new "characters" enter the Zodiac arena over the decades, I have lost count. There are now as many of these "revisionist" witnesses and suspects as there are cipher solutions!

3/8/2019 03:43:38 pm

oops

But, if we throw out the statements made
by Crow in stead of try to make them fit -
then things look clearer.

3/9/2019 08:45:47 am

I think when William Crow made himself out to be a tough guy at the LHR scene, he threw off the investigators.
His lies set the investigation out on a wild goose chase. Looking for two zodiacs. And a car that never existed.
None of the forensics confirmed anything he had to say. According to Raymond Grant the account of William Crow is patently false. A big city cop would have seen through Crow's lies. Big city cops know when somebody's lips are moving - their lying.

Richard

3/9/2019 09:16:10 am

Yes BB, I have come to question the testimony of William Crow. He may very well have exaggerated his account for his 15 minutes of fame. The embellished 2nd version of his story makes his original account all the more unbelievable.

[1] Mr Crow put the car in gear and took off at a high rate of speed and the car followed him at a high rate of speed. They did not attempt to gain on him, but when they got to the turn off towards Benicia, William Crow turned towards Benicia and the other car went straight ahead.
[2] "I sped up. The car behind me also sped up, and at one point as I was looking over my shoulder, the car behind me came up on my side with its right front fender near the driver’s rear quarter panel and appeared to be moving toward making contact. I shifted to a lower gear and hit the gas. There is a fork in the road where one continues toward Benicia and the other more towards the freeway toward Vallejo. The other car was clearly chasing me and I waited until the last moment and then turned off.

[1] William Crow turned towards Benicia and the other car went straight ahead. The subjects were both Caucasians and there is no further identification on the car or the subjects.
[2] After some moments, the other car turned around in the roadway and went back down the road from which we had come. I kept making macho statements, but not totally without some sense about me, I drove home. I did not see the car again. I could not see the passenger seat, but the driver was a man with short hair and glasses. I did not see his specific facial features.

[1] Blue Valiant
[2] light-colored Chevy

[1] Two Caucasians
[2] I could not see the passenger seat, but the driver was a man with short hair and glasses. I did not see his specific facial features.

Two completely different stories, with the menace and bravado increasing in the second version. His story is more than likely a sham. It appears he was a publicity seeker.

3/9/2019 09:06:51 am

mike r
William Lewis Crow
http://www.zodiackillersite.com/viewtopic.php?t=542

3/9/2019 12:03:55 pm

The audacity of this guy!

He is a lawyer
He knows how to work the system
He does not display any curiosity
Because he knows?
He does not cooperate with interviewers
He deflects their questions.
He does not want to know who the Zodiac is.
Because he knows?
He is not interested in finding out who the killer is.
Because he knows?
He has an amazingly huge ego.

Just like the disappearance of Madeleine McCann
The parents never show any curiosity for where their
missing child is. Why - because they know.
They have no concern for their child's wellbeing.
Because they know.
They just keep say she was abducted even though
all the forensics points to a dead body in the apt and the car.
No curiosity in a case you are involved in?
That is how you know when they are lying.
No curiosity.

My Name Is Mine

3/9/2019 01:33:15 pm

Yes BB, what you say is 100% true.

As for the MM case, I recall watching a doco some time ago and the team of forensic investigators could find absolutely no evidence at all that the house had been broken into. The crime scene looked staged in their honest assessment. Plus LE had 48 unanswered questions due to a failure to co-operate in providing those answers from one parent. Such facts tend often to "speak volumes".

Comments are closed.

WILL-I-AM THE MURDERER

Archives