ZODIAC CIPHERS
RICHARD GRINELL, COVENTRY, ENGLAND
  • Home
    • Search This Site With Google
    • The Mount Diablo Map and Code Solution
  • Zodiac News
    • Zodiac News Archive
    • Santa Barbara Attack
    • Cheri Jo Bates
    • The Confession
    • Riverside Desktop Poem
    • Bates Letter
    • The Forgotten Victims
    • Welsh Chappie - Zodiac News
  • Lake Herman Murders
    • Blue Rock Springs Attack
    • Vallejo Times Letter
    • Examiner Letter
    • Chronicle Letter
    • Complete 408 Cipher
    • Vallejo and Benicia Map
    • Kathie Snoozy and Debra Furlong Murders
    • Debut of Zodiac Letter
  • Lake Berryessa Attack
    • Presidio Heights Attack
    • Call to Chat Show
  • 340 Cipher
    • Bus Bomb Letter
    • Betsy Aardsma Murder
    • The Fairfield Letter
    • Melvin Belli Letter
    • Santa Barbara Murders 1970
    • Modesto Attack
    • My Name is Cipher
    • Dragon Card and Button Letter >
      • Phillips Road Map
    • The Sleeping Bag Murders
    • The Little List Letter
  • The Halloween Card
    • Lake Tahoe Disappearance
    • Los Angeles Times Letter
    • The Monticello Card
    • The Exorcist Letter
  • SLA Letter
    • Red Phantom Letter/American Greetings Card
    • The 1978 Letter
    • Los Angeles Times Newspaper Articles
    • Zodiac Letters Real or Fake
    • Zodiac Documentary
    • Unsolved Mysteries
    • The Colonial Parkway Murders
  • Suspects
    • Arthur Leigh Allen
    • Rick Marshall
    • Lawrence Kane
    • Theodore Kaczynski
    • Richard Gaikowski
    • Gareth Penn
    • Jack Tarrance

THE ZODIAC WAS ABOUT 40 IN 69

7/30/2019

 
This is an article examining the age of the Zodiac Killer in 1969. Many people have argued that the Zodiac Killer, through four attacks, wasn't one individual because of the varying age estimations, differing from 26-30 by Michael Mageau, 20-30 by Bryan Hartnell (voice concept) and 25-30 by the three teenagers at Presidio Heights, up to 35-45 by Officer Donald Fouke and about 40 by the Julius Kahn playground eyewitnesses. However, this really isn't the case when we consider that Michael Mageau's testimony cannot be relied upon, bearing in mind he was blinded by the light from the assailant's vehicle and flashlight, while being shot in the head. His recollection of the events are unclear, with probably less than a second to make a visual on the suspect's face. On page 10 of the police report he gave a description of the assailant which included his age, but followed this immediately by the statement "Was unable to judge real well what his age was". He also admitted to only seeing a side profile of the killer, which tells you how little time elapsed between the assailant arriving at the passenger door and when he began firing. 

In the following attack at Lake Berryessa, Bryan Hartnell never saw the suspect's face at all, so we only have a recollection of "voice concept", which in not particularly ideal. A 2010 study from the Journal of Social, Evolutionary, and Cultural Psychology found that when people try to guess the age of male speakers over the age of 35, or female speakers over age 55, they’re at least 10 years off on average. They also tend to underestimate the age of speakers as they get older. Additonally, Bryan Hartnell stated to Napa detectives regarding the voice on the Jim Dunbar Show and featured in the San Francisco Chronicle on October 24th 1969, that "he remembers Zodiac's voice as much older and deeper than the one heard in the series of telephone calls to KGO-TV". The next line in the newspaper article added that his opinion was backed up by Napa police Patrolman Dave Slaight and Vallejo police clerk Nancy Slover. The caller to the Jim Dunbar Show was Eric Weill, who was aged 29 at the time. This means that Bryan Hartnell described the Zodiac's voice as much older and deeper than a 29-year-old, and is in direct conflict to his earlier estimate of 20 to 30 years. This clearly demonstrates the inaccuracy of determining age through voice concept. The only attack where the Zodiac Killer's face was seen for any reasonable length of time was on October 11th 1969. At Presidio Heights there were three sets of eyewitnesses who saw the Zodiac Killer from the taxicab to the park - and all gave the same age. The three teenagers described a man in his early forties in the police report on October 12th 1969, Officer Donald Fouke described the man as 35-45 (therefore a median age of 40) and the Julius Kahn playground eyewitnesses described the man running into the park as about 40. Three sets of eyewitnesses pinpointing the Zodiac Killer as 40 years of age or slightly above, within a five minute window.

These three sets of eyewitnesses gave a very similar description, as follows:
The three teenagers described the suspect to the police dispatcher as ​a "WMA, in his early forties, 5'8'', heavy build, reddish-blond "crew-cut" hair, wearing eyeglasses, dark brown trousers, dark (navy blue or black) "Parka" jacket, dark shoes". Donald Fouke described the suspect as a "WMA, 35-45 yrs, about 5'10", 180-200 lbs, medium heavy build, barrel chested, medium complexion, light colored hair possibly graying in rear, crew cut, wearing glasses. Dressed in dark blue waist length zipper type jacket (navy or royal blue). Brown wool pants". The eyewitnesses at Julius Kahn playground (Spruce Street) described the suspect in the San Francisco Chronicle article on October 12th 1969 as "white, about 40, 170 pounds, a blond crewcut, wearing glasses. He was wearing dark shoes, dark grey trousers and jacket". The only minor difference being brown trousers described as dark grey. Every other detail matched up in this five minute window.
  
PictureOctober 18th 1969
We can of course throw away or disregard the last sighting of a man running into the park and matching the other two descriptions, if our theory revolves around the Zodiac Killer never entering the park or getting into a vehicle along Jackson Street, but this again relies on cherry-picking the evidence to suit our theory, rather than let the evidence or eyewitness testimony become the driver.

The three teenagers never described the suspect as 25-30 years - only the October 13th 1969 police sketch did. Their account was comprehensively detailed in the police report countersigned by Officer Armond Pelissetti on October 12th 1969. Their viewing of the suspect "last seen walking north on Cherry Street, from Washington Street" was the only eyewitness testimony in the police report, and therefore the suspect description on page 2 could only have been derived from them. It stated the man was in his early forties. It couldn't have been from the other two sets of eyewitnesses because the police report clearly states that the suspect was "last seen walking north on Cherry Street, from Washington Street". The other eyewitnesses viewed the suspect after Cherry Street.

The three teenagers sat down with a sketch artist who interpreted their description of the man - and it's extremely likely that because the sketch was interpreted and drawn looking younger, the police attributed the age range of 25-30 years to it - likely believing this was the correct course of action based on the appearance of the sketch. In other words, the contradiction of the three teenagers early forties description in the police report to the appearance of the sketch, likely played a part in the revision of the age range placed on the wanted poster. However, it is apparent that the three teenagers were not happy with the first sketch, forcing the police to create an amended sketch more in line with their original early forties description. The police then released the amended sketch on October 18th 1969 with a compromise age range of 35-45 years, which allowed for any slight error either way. To believe the three teenagers described the suspect as in his "early forties" in the police report on October 12th 1969, but one day later completely backpedalled to 25-30, defies logic. Especially when you consider the sketch was amended to 35-45 on October 18th 1969 with their help. Obviously dissatisfied with how the first sketch was presented. 

PictureOfficer Donald Fouke
If we factor in Officer Donald Fouke's description of a man "older and heavier" with a "lumbering gait", possibly "graying in the rear" with a "widows peak", we could be looking at a much more mature Zodiac Killer. A killer who described David Faraday (17), Betty Lou Jensen (16), Michael Mageau (19) and Darlene Ferrin (22) as boy, girl and kids in his initial correspondence. Our suspect is unlikely to be a young man aged between 25-30 years, addressing a 19 and 22-year-old as a boy, girl or kid. The way the Zodiac Killer addressed the couple at Blue Rock Springs Park suggests more of a generational divide.

Here is an excerpt by Donn Devine: "But just how long is a generation? Don’t we all know as a matter of common knowledge that it generally averages about 25 years from the birth of a parent to the birth of a child, even though it varies case by case? And wasn’t it closer to 20 years in earlier times when humans mated younger and life expectancies were shorter? Where did those numbers come from? Several recent studies by a sociologist-demographer and groups of population geneticists and biological anthropologists show that male-line generations, from father to son, are always longer on average than female-line generations, from mother to daughter. They show, too, that both are longer than the 25-year interval that conventional wisdom has assigned to a generation. The male generation is at least a third longer, the female generation is longer by perhaps half that amount".

Most people affix around 20-25 years to a generation, so if we take the average of the four victim's ages from the first two attacks, we would arrive at 19 years. Add the generational divide of 20-25 years and we have a suspect between 39-44 years of age - a man in his early forties or about 40. We know the attack at Presidio Heights was a Zodiac crime because of the blooded shirt piece of taxicab driver Paul Stine being mailed to the San Francisco Chronicle. Therefore, these three sets of eyewitnesses in a time window of just five minutes, all describing a man about 40 years of age, should carry great value. But does this argument have any sway with the long-held convictions of people regarding suspects in the Zodiac case, or will no amount of eyewitness testimony alter the lens through which they view the Zodiac case? This analysis has been performed in an objective fashion because I have no allegiance to any suspect whatsoever. However, somebody approaching this topic with a subjective analysis, looking at this case through the lens of their favorite suspect, will inevitably cherry-pick which eyewitnesses to believe or dismiss (or give credence to) based on what is convenient to their suspect's age. If people are going to use the first police sketch on October 13th 1969 with an age range of 25-30 to bolster the case for their young suspect, then they should also accept the rest of the material present on this sketch, such as the killer sat in the front seat, tells the driver the destination as the Washington & Laurel area or area near Park or Presidio, and upon reaching destination, orders driver to continue on at gunpoint. This of course is all fiction, yet the 25-30 age range is routinely quoted as the suspect's age, despite the three teenagers never once stating this to be the case.    

In 1969, the ages of the most widely touted suspects were: Theodore Kaczynski (27), Bruce Davis (27), Gareth Penn (28), Ross Sullivan (28), Richard Gaikowski (33), Arthur Leigh Allen (35), Richard Marshall (41), Lawrence Kane (45) and Kjell Qvale (50). Based on the eyewitness testimony at Presidio Heights, only two candidates fit the age description of the Zodiac Killer and these are poor suspects at best. The farther we travel to either end of the suspect age-scale spectrum, the weaker the argument becomes for these men to be the infamous Zodiac Killer. People often defy their years, but the argument still stands.
We have multiple eyewitnesses at Presidio Heights, all of whom were able to give fairly detailed descriptions of a killer emerging from the taxicab, heading up Cherry Street, turning into Jackson Street, before seeking refuge in the Presidio Park just after 10:00 pm. These are without doubt the best eyewitnesses we have in the Zodiac case. 

Shawn
7/30/2019 10:13:08 am

Officer Foukes was a veteran police officer by the time he encountered Zodiac.

I would think he would be trained or through years of policing to know people ages by looks pretty good. Even ones that might look older than they actually are, hence the age Range of 35 to 45 that was established on the revision wanted poster.

In Zodiac letters, Zodiac seemed like an older man looking from the outside in on modern culture of the late 1960's referencing "Blue Meannies", "Buttons".

"Everyone has those buttons like Peace, Black Power, Melvin eats blubber, etc"

Bryan Hartnell had a lengthy conversation with Zodiac but described him to be under 35 by voice. But from the physical appearance he described. To me he described an older mature man with a pot belly and maybe a younger sounding voice.

Richard
7/30/2019 11:21:45 am

I certainly think Officer Donald Fouke's testimony is the most relevant because he had 5, 10, 15 seconds from first spotting him to passing him (in his words) being able to describe the elasticated cuffs, tan-engineering boots and hair graying in the rear. This being the case, he certainly would have managed a good estimate of his age. If you believe he stopped and spoke to Zodiac (as I do) the estimate is even more convincing. But I guess people are split on that issue Shawn. Police, as you said, are trained to be observant. The 'buttons' reference of "everyone else has these buttons like, black power, melvin eats bluber, etc. Well it would cheer me up considerably if I saw a lot of people wearing my buton", does sound like somebody on the outside looking in. Not to mention his reference to distant productions, such as The Mikado, The Most Dangerous Game, Herman Melville (Moby Dick) and possibly Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra in Golden Gate Park (hinting at his next blast). Even some have suggested a Charlie Chan and Alfred Hitchcock link.

Richard
7/30/2019 12:52:00 pm

Also Shawn (if the Zodiac was the Riverside murderer) he would have been about 37 years of age in 1966. The tone of the Confession letter detailing the "brush offs" during the years prior, more suggestive of somebody of similar age to Cheri Jo Bates, rather than 19 years her senior. Of course, the murder on the college campus, coupled with this wording may have been designed to give the impression of a younger killer, along with the immature nature of the correspondence.

art
7/30/2019 10:36:29 am

Excellent! This is the approach of sticking to the most highly verified facts (prioritized by degree of verification) as a bedrock. Would love to see more of that, and extended to a full compendium of characteristics from highly verified down to highly speculative. How does the Kathleen Johns description fit into this? For some reason, the classic sketch you have attached here in this article makes it difficult for me to see that head on a 5'10" stocky, barrel chested, heavyset body type (endomorph). The face seems to fit a more slender or medium body build (mesomorph). Maybe that is splitting hairs, but it just seems to me that adding the witness described body shape onto this head sketch would do a better job of jogging memories for anyone that knew Z in his everyday life etc. And with computer graphics, it could be quite helpful to see that rendered in more of a 3D format. I wonder if someone here on the forum has that skill set...

Richard
7/30/2019 11:27:10 am

Unfortunately Art, a 3D rendered format is beyond me, but it wouldn't be too difficult to find a Google image of the body type described and blend a realistic 'Zodiac face' onto it. We just need a 5'10" stocky, barrel chested, heavyset body type to mesh the two together. Then fashion the clothing.

Richard
7/30/2019 11:34:39 am

There was actually another witness that came forward - the 8-year-old from the Alex Lewis redacted FBI file naming Xenophon Anthony. The 8-year-old may possibly have been mistaken, but Xenophon Anthony was 38 years of age in 1969, and thereby again identifying a more mature individual of around 40. Four sets of eyewitnesses of about 40.

Sully link
7/30/2019 10:19:55 pm

The 3 LB sunbathing gals gave Ken Narlows crew a combo sketch of the handsome guy who wouldnt make eye contact.
Was Zodiac pondering if he could tie up and slash 3 women and then get down the very narrow, serpentine road BEFORE any Napa sheriffs evening shift started on their Angwin/Lake Berryessa Route ??
Z decided on a remote spot to wear the Halloween mask and test out the "control with fear" method. But the costume thing was a brand new act for Zodiac, unless done in 1963 with Robert and Linda... in another very secluded spot. But maybe Zodiac didnt need to wear a mask that day.
He just quickly shot them both, like Betty, David, Darlene and Mike.

Richard
7/31/2019 01:19:16 am

I do believe this was Zodiac viewing the women, but I cannot understand why there is no mention of comparing his bootprints to the crime scene bootprints, then we would maybe have unequivocal proof of a link and thereby rendering the sketch extremely valid. The fact that we and law enforcement have been pondering the link for the past 50 years suggests this comparison was never done. I have a feeling the location and time played a big part in him refraining from using a gun, along with extremely limited exit routes - only the Knoxville Road. But I suspect that the knife was his predetermined choice to ensure front page coverage, hence the emphasis of "by knife" on the car door. The girls were likely his failed attempt that day, probably due to the difficulty in controlling three people or maybe he noticed other people in the vicinity. Either way, if you believe this was Zodiac, he ultimately aborted the attempt.

Shawn
7/30/2019 09:31:36 pm

I think age could have played a reason why Zodiac might have stopped killing after Stine. (or at least publicizing) The average age of death for males in 1969 was 67.

Many people back then smoked and did not eat very healthy with the advent of processed foods.

After almost getting caught after killing Stine he might have simply said to himself....I'm getting too old for this.

Richard
7/31/2019 05:21:02 am

Dennis Rader and Gary Ridgeway were two killers who both had extended breaks from their murderous campaign of terror and both made their last killing in their 40s. Dennis Rader was 45 and Gary Ridgeway was 49. The Zodiac Killer was nearer to the exploits of Rader, with the communications and phone calls - and he ceased from 1991 to his arrest in 2005. In 2004 he sent and left many packages and letters. It was a floppy disc that undid him. So, it wouldn't be that difficult to swallow that Zodiac was still communicating in the late 70s, up to 1987. He was probably wiser than Rader and with decreasing health, had a swansong of letters until late 71 and then moved on - likely changing state.

Richard
7/31/2019 01:04:59 pm

I know there are varied age descriptions given by the 3 girls at Berryessa, but on page 8 of the police report they described the subject as approximately 40 years old.
http://www.zodiackiller.com/LBReport8.html

Shawn
8/1/2019 06:46:45 am

Seems like Zodiac might have been inspired by comics when he was younger. Ex. (Tim Holt 1952)

I was thinking of comics that might have caught his eye at a young age. (if he was around the age of 40 in 69)

There was a USA rah rah WW2 Newspaper comic strip in the 1940's called "Racing Riley and the Commandos". The Strip featured a French Villain Astrologer in German occupied France named Seira Caidoz. He was said to read the stars for Hitler.

Seira Caidoz spelled (Backwords Aug. 4th Letter) spells "Aries Zodiac". A clever play on words on a sign of the Zodiac

Hitler was an Aries born April 20, 1889. 81 Years later Zodiac would mail the "My Name" letter on April 20.

https://ibb.co/gVN3Ks7

Just a thought to add to the database of potential clues.

Shawn
8/1/2019 10:46:53 am

2 corrections from above

Race Riley and the Commandos

Hitler was born a Taurus.....April 20 is first Day of Taurus after Aries
Ends April 19

My Name letter mailed April 29, first day of Taurus. Code has what appears to be the sign of Taurus 3x according to some.....Also what appears as upside down Aries sign

Shawn
8/7/2019 08:52:30 am

I also found out that White Supremist and Neo Nazis use "88" to represent HH or "Heil Hitler". H being the 8th letter in the alphabet. I do not know if 88 was used in 1969. But it is kinda interesting that Hilter was born on 4/20, the date, the 888 laden "My Name" Zodiac cipher was postmarked.

In white nationalism and supremacism

Nazi graffiti with the number 88
Neo-Nazis use the number 88 as an abbreviation for the Nazi salute Heil Hitler.[8] The letter H is eighth in the alphabet, whereby 88 becomes HH.

Often, this number is associated with the number 14, e.g. 14/88, 14-88, or 1488; this number symbolizes the Fourteen Words coined by David Lane, a prominent white supremacist.[10] Example uses of 88 include the song "88 Rock 'n' Roll Band" by Landser, and the organizations Column 88 and Unit 88. Currently, the Michigan-based American Nazi Party uses 14 in its domain name and 88 as part of a radio sign-off.[citation needed]




Comments are closed.
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture

    All
    13 Hole Postcard
    148 Character Cipher
    1978 Letter
    1986 Letter
    1987 Letter
    2001 Happy New Year Card
    Albany Letter
    Allan/Peyton Murders
    Arthur Leigh Allen
    Atlanta Letter
    Betsy Aardsma
    Blue Rock Springs Attack
    Bus Bomb Letter
    Button Letter
    Call To Chat Show
    Carol Beth Hilburn
    Channel 9 Letter
    Cheri Jo Bates
    Cipher Theories
    Citizen Card
    Concerned Citizen Card
    Confession Letter
    Daniel Williams Poisoning
    Debut Of Zodiac Letter
    Deep Real Estate Ad
    DMV Letter
    Domingos/Edwards Murders
    Donald Lee Bujok
    Donna Lass
    Dragon Card
    Earl Van Best Jr
    Eureka Card
    Exorcist Letter
    Fairfield Letter
    Fingerprint Evidence
    Forecast For Cancer
    Forecast For Leo
    Gareth Penn
    General News Articles
    Gilbert And Sullivan
    Good Citizen Letter
    Halloween Card
    Hood/Garcia Murders
    Internet Articles
    Joan Webster
    Johnny & Joyce Swindle
    Judith Hakari
    Kevin Robert Brooks
    Lake Berryessa Attack
    Lake Herman Road Murders
    Lake Tahoe Disappearance
    Larry Kane
    Leona Roberts Murder
    Los Angeles Letter
    Melvin Belli Letter
    Mike Morford (Morf13)
    Modesto Attack
    Molina/Rodriguez Murders
    Monticello Card
    My Name Is Letter
    Nancy Bennallack
    New Canaan Letters
    Novato Letter
    Oakland A's Letter
    Pines Card
    Possible Zodiac Attacks
    Possible Zodiac Letters
    Presidio Heights Murder
    Radians
    Red Phantom Letter
    Richard Gaikowski
    Riverside Desktop Poem
    Robert Salem Murder
    Ross Sullivan
    Saechao/Saelee Murders
    San Jose Code Letter
    Santa Claus Card
    Scorpion Ciphers
    Scotch Tape Letter
    Sla Letter
    Tamalpais Valley Attack
    Ted Kaczynski
    Telegraph Avenue Incident
    The 340 Cipher
    The 408 Cipher
    The Celebrity Cypher
    The Little List
    The Mikado
    Thomas Horan
    You Are Next Letter
    Zodiac Letters Poll
    Zodiac Postage
    Zodiac Theories

    Picture

    RSS Feed

    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    The Zodiac Killer may have given us the answer almost word-for-word when he wrote PS. The Mt. Diablo Code concerns Radians & # inches along the radians. The code solution identified was Estimate: Four Radians and Five Inches To read more, click the image.
    Picture
    Picture
    The Zodiac Atlas: The Zodiac Killer Enigma by Randall Scott Clemons. Click image for details.
    Picture
    The Zodiac Killer Map: Part of the Zodiac Killer Enigma by Randall Scott Clemons. Click image for color version
    For black and white issue..
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture
    Picture

    Archives

    May 2025
    April 2025
    March 2025
    February 2025
    January 2025
    December 2024
    November 2024
    October 2024
    September 2024
    August 2024
    July 2024
    June 2024
    May 2024
    April 2024
    March 2024
    February 2024
    January 2024
    December 2023
    November 2023
    September 2023
    August 2023
    July 2023
    June 2023
    May 2023
    April 2023
    March 2023
    February 2023
    January 2023
    December 2022
    November 2022
    October 2022
    September 2022
    August 2022
    July 2022
    June 2022
    May 2022
    April 2022
    March 2022
    January 2022
    December 2021
    November 2021
    October 2021
    September 2021
    August 2021
    July 2021
    June 2021
    May 2021
    April 2021
    March 2021
    February 2021
    January 2021
    December 2020
    November 2020
    October 2020
    September 2020
    August 2020
    July 2020
    June 2020
    May 2020
    April 2020
    March 2020
    February 2020
    January 2020
    December 2019
    November 2019
    October 2019
    September 2019
    August 2019
    July 2019
    June 2019
    May 2019
    April 2019
    March 2019
    February 2019
    January 2019
    December 2018
    November 2018
    October 2018
    September 2018
    August 2018
    July 2018
    June 2018
    May 2018
    April 2018
    March 2018
    February 2018
    January 2018
    December 2017
    November 2017
    October 2017
    September 2017
    August 2017
    July 2017
    June 2017
    May 2017
    April 2017
    March 2017
    February 2017
    January 2017
    December 2016
    November 2016
    October 2016
    September 2016
    August 2016
    July 2016
    June 2016
    May 2016
    April 2016
    March 2016
    February 2016
    January 2016
    December 2015
    November 2015
    August 2015
    July 2015
    June 2015
    May 2015
    April 2015
    March 2015
    February 2015
    January 2015
    December 2014
    November 2014
    October 2014
    September 2014
    August 2014
    July 2014
    June 2014
    May 2014
    April 2014
    March 2014
    February 2014
    January 2014
    December 2013
    November 2013
    October 2013
    September 2013
    August 2013
    July 2013
    June 2013
    May 2013
    April 2013
    February 2013
    January 2013
    December 2012
    November 2012
    October 2012
    September 2012
    July 2012
    January 2012

Picture
Picture
Picture
Picture
Picture
Photos from Marcin Wichary, zAppledot, vyusseem, Alex Barth, Alan Cleaver, jocelynsart, Richard Perry, taberandrew, eschipul, MrJamesAckerley