THE "PACE" POSTCARD AUTHENTIC

8/14/2019

Question marks have always hung over the October 5th 1970 13-Hole Postcard as to whether the author was the Zodiac Killer or a copycat. This article will hopefully go a long way to convince people that the communication was indeed mailed by the Bay Area murderer. The Zodiac Killer wrote the lengthy Little List Letter on July 26th 1970, beginning the correspondence with his intentions for his slaves in paradise, followed by the torture methods he was going to apply, before finishing with the plagiarism of Gilbert & Sullivan's The Mikado, from the Act As Some Day it May Happen. The crucial thing to remember here, is that the Little List Letter was withheld from the newspapers and public alike, so by October 5th 1970 when this postcard was mailed, the author (if not Zodiac} was totally unaware to the contents of the Little List Letter. It is possible that the Zodiac Killer could have been reemphasizing his victim total of thirteen after his previous letter was unpublished, or a copycat could have been suggesting thirteen victims for the first time, unaware that the Little List Letter had ever been mailed. Therefore, this is no help in determining whether the author of the 13-Hole Postcard was the Zodiac Killer or not. We need to look at the wording on both communications back to back.

The first thing to notice on the 13-Hole Postcard is the crucifix and number 13 in close alliance - extremely relevant when we consider the Zodiac Killer using the phrase "I shall (on top of everything else) torture all 13 of my slaves that I have waiting for me in Paradice" in the Little List Letter. The crucifix, a symbol of Christianity and the progression from life on earth to the paradise of heaven, is further cemented by the October 27th 1970 Halloween Card where the Zodiac Killer actually combines all three elements. However, if you are also a skeptic of the Halloween Card, then we need to focus entirely on finding a link between the 13-Hole Postcard and the previously unpublished Little List Letter, both eventually released in tandem with one another on October 12th 1970 in a newspaper article by Paul Avery. Below I have separated the Little List Letter into its constituent parts - his promise of torture, his methods of torture and the search for victims.

[1] This is the Zodiac speaking. Being that you will not wear some nice buttons, how about wearing some nasty buttons. Or any kind of buttons that you can think up. If you do not wear any type of buttons, I shall (on top of everything else) torture all 13 of my slaves that I have waiting for me in Paradice.

[2] Some I shall tie over ant hills and watch them scream + twich and sqwirm. Others shall have pine splinters driven under their nails + then burned. Others shall be placed in cages + fed salt beef untill they are gorged then I shall listen to their pleass for water and I shall laugh at them. Others will hang by their thumbs + burn in the sun then I will rub them down with deep heat to warm them up. Others I shall skin them alive + let them run around screaming. And all billiard players I shall have them play in a darkened dungen cell with crooked cues + Twisted Shoes. Yes I shall have great fun inflicting the most delicious of pain to my slaves.

The Mikado/Act I/Part Va - As Some Day it May Happen
[3] As some day it may hapen that a victom must be found. I've got a little list. I've got a little list, of society offenders who might well be underground who would never be missed who would never be missed.

Arthur Sullivan

The Zodiac Killer refers to his victims in the plural and in the future tense, beginning his torture methods with "Some I shall tie over ant hills and watch them scream + twich and sqwirm. Others shall have pine splinters driven under their nails + then burned. Others shall be placed in cages + fed salt beef untill they are gorged then I shall listen to their pleass for water and I shall laugh at them". He uses the word "some" to begin his rhetoric, then continues with his Little List of potential victims, sourced from As Some Day it May Happen, beginning with "As some day it may hapen that a victom must be found". Therefore, is it any great surprise that the Zodiac Killer having noted his lengthy communication was not published in the newspapers, would begin the 13-Hole Postcard in the past tense, stating "The pace isn't any slower. In fact it's just one big thirteenth. Some of them fought it was horrible". The last sentence likely referring to the slaves he previously mentioned he was going to torture.

The Zodiac Killer is effectively saying that he had now tortured his victims in paradice and "some of them had fought". He is telling Paul Avery and the San Francisco Chronicle newspaper he had made good on his promises. This strongly suggests that the author of the 13-Hole Postcard knew the contents of the July 26th 1970 Little List Letter, thereby cementing the notion that the Zodiac Killer was the author of both communications. The alternative, is that a copycat just threw together a random postcard that not only continued the theme of the previous letter accidentally, but was adopted by the Zodiac Killer in the October 27th 1970 Halloween Card and the following March 13th 1971 letter, where the Zodiac Killer stated "This is the Zodiac speaking Like I have allways said, I am crack proof". The copycat scenario proliferated by many, a sensational subplot to discredit certain Zodiac communications and attacks, where no merit for such claims exist.

The other notable element of the 13-Hole Postcard is the Mon, Oct 5, 1970 attribution in the top right corner. The Zodiac Killer did recite the Gilbert & Sullivan Act As Some Day it May Happen. So was Monday, October 5th the day something happened - and the reason he added a specific date for the very first time?

Rubislaw 32 link

8/14/2019 04:26:29 am

Not so long ago,you featured the ''13 Hole'' card,Richard....and I am grateful that you did,in that it gave me the opportunity of really focusing on the fullness of its meaning.

So,this time round,I should just like to ask the,perhaps,rhetorical enquiry of how it is that,none of the correspondences that ''might'' be attributable to the Zodiac....that are ''cut and paste'',in the main...are ''not'' confirmed as ''Zodiac authentic'' [?].

Is ''cut and paste'' as a form of corresponding,a preclusion for authentication,by the FBI [?].

Or,is this ''phenomenon'',with the Zodiac case,simply a conicidence [?].

Richard

8/14/2019 05:42:11 am

I think it's the simple fact that a postcard has been created with pasted words rather than handwriting, that leads some to the false assumption that the author has done it to disguise the fact they are a fraud or copycat. The Monticello card was featured in the authentic 2000 DNA list of letters and that can be correlated with the Pines card. I think all three are genuine, even though the claimed murders in 2 of them are either false or questionable.

Richard

8/14/2019 06:04:54 am

The only prevailing argument I have seen for the 13 Hole postcard not being Zodiac, is he wrote 13 twice. But that argument is unfounded when you consider his last 13 victims count wasn't published in the newspapers. Without this as an argument, what else could possibly lead to a conclusion it wasn't Zodiac. The fact it was pasted and Zodiac hadn't done that before is not an argument, otherwise we could exclude everything Zodiac did for the first time as well. What reason the police or paper had for withholding the Little List letter one can only guess.

Richard

8/14/2019 06:17:50 am

The FBI cannot possibly preclude this letter based on what is available. I may be wrong, but I take the default position of a Zodiac correspondence being Zodiac. until good evidence or argument proves otherwise. The reasons above are my arguments for a genuine correspondence, but I cannot think of one single reason that points to a copycat. So in weighing the likelihood one way or another, I tend to go with the what is more likely. There is no handwriting available in the above card, so we have to analyse its structure and wording based around, not only the 340 cipher and previous material, but more importantly the content of the Little List letter, that should give us clues to either somebody aware of the tone of the previous letter, or somebody seemingly unaware. There appears enough to make a reasonable argument to claim a connection. If there are any pertinent factors that point to a copycat I'm all ears and will certainly reassess my conclusions.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/14/2019 09:08:11 am

Thanks for your opinions.....and it certainly ''bolsters'' what I feel inside about the ''cut and pastes''.

It would have been helpful if the FBI,at least explained,themselves,over their general perceptions,regarding this form of correspondence.One might think that the ''cut and pastes'' have great potential,for concealing forensic evidence [?].

I feel even more determined,now,to find the source of those two ''Day-by-Day'' forecasts for Leo and Cancer,in December 1969.

I am personally,of the opinion that the Zodiac,had moved his ''primary'' home,from Memphis to Greater L.A.,between the ''408'' and Lake Berryessa.....and,if I can find the publication source,for those two ''cut and pastes''.....then ''who knows'' what else clues,might turn up.

To this day,the FBI still keep ''much'' close to their chest [?].

Richard

8/14/2019 03:38:38 pm

I reckon the answer to these communications and their source will be found Rubislaw. Whether these December letters were Zodiac or not (I believe they are), the answer will lie in the news coverage immediately preceding them. Find the topic and find the meaning.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/14/2019 03:55:31 pm

Just to qualify my previous comment,I believe that,up to the ''408''....and from the beginning of 1968 to July 1969....that the Zodiac,was predominently,commuting between his ''primary'' home and ''secondary'' one [Vallejo] ,by air.

Then,from around September 1969,the commute between Vallejo,and ''new'' primary home [Greater L.A.]....became exclusively,by motorcar.

Hence,the ''Day-by-Day'' forecasts,in part,represented a reflection on ''new horizons'' and past air travel.

Could be an ''In Flight'' publication,that represents the materials used,to put the ''Day-by-Day'' ''cut and pastes'',together.

I bet the FBI know the answer.

Richard

8/14/2019 11:23:14 pm

That would make Zodiac a commuter or marauder of sorts in respect to serial killers - travelling between locations to commit his crimes. However, this wouldn't make pinpointing his home location any more difficult in the example you suggest, as he would have a fixed address in both locations, as opposed to somebody who just kills at a secondary location just to deflect attention away from their residence.

8/14/2019 05:09:36 pm

re: October 5 postcard. Charles Manson and his followers made the front page news in a big banner on Oct. 5, 1970 for their multiple outbursts(including chanting phrases about killing) in the courtroom. Also, that was the day they released the name of Kenneth Comstock of Fort Bragg as the killer of Santa Rosa junior college coed Wenda Howard. Her death made the papers on the 4th, having been stabbed 11 times. She was the third Santa Rosa coed to have been murdered in the past 4 months. Do you think one of these items triggered the postcard?

Richard

8/15/2019 12:20:15 am

Something like that is exactly what we should be looking for - the Zodiac responding to the newspaper coverage. The vast majority of his correspondence was in response to something he read, so bearing in mind he was referring to a Little List, attaching a date to the communication listing a specific time, should in theory have an associated event or murder. Sometimes I may overread something in a communication, but placing that date on the postcard should have a purpose. Cheers JD.

Richard

8/15/2019 12:27:56 am

The "You are next" postcard read "Mon Oct 12, 1970. Edward Adams. The Zodiac is going to change the way of committing murders. I shall announce when I shall commit my murders, The Adamses are Next. you taught me to mean it. ADAMS YOU ARE NEXT. Zodiac." This was postmarked October 17th but dated Oct 12. Was Adams scheduled for Mon, Oct 19.

Richard

8/15/2019 12:31:28 am

Was he now announcing his murder dates, Oct 5, Oct 12, Oct 19. The Adams card arrived 2 days before the Monday. This almost sounds like a list.

art

8/14/2019 10:11:40 pm

Any chance that “Fk” is shorthand (in that time period) for “For (your) knowledge”? Just looking for an Occam’s razor explanation for that Fk...

Richard

8/14/2019 11:07:10 pm

"For (your) knowledge I'm crackproof" is another possibility. In theory, we shouldn't be looking for a name because the k isn't upper case. It wasn't in the 340, nor in your example. The problem however, is Riverside was written in lower case in the March 13th 1971 letter, as was rh on the desktop. In this instance, I tend to go with the lower case option as part of a phrase, as in your example.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/14/2019 11:32:41 pm

Nice spot from art.I researched this before,and there are two other ''Fk'' 's for the time.

i] French kisses

ii] Fuck knows

I feel confident,it ''always was'',.....''Fuck knows''.

Perhaps people pronounced it : ''Fitzgerald Kennedy'' [?].

8/15/2019 01:11:41 am

I tried sending this as a response to the earlier post, but there is a glitch of some sort so this response is out of order. Sorry. I'm not finding any reference to the Zodiac as a suspect in Santa Rosa during that time frame, though that doesn't mean anything. I'm not sure about the other murders mentioned in the one article. Kenneth B. Comstock eventually pled guilty in the Wenda Howard case; the attack was fueled by an LSD trip. Did come across a 12 Nov. 1970 article re: Midnight Killer in Berkley that involved 6 different shootings, victims all males. It talked about the possibility of a Zodiac connection, though they had no evidence to support the notion.

Richard

8/15/2019 03:00:04 am

The dates he supplied JD could have simply been dates he claimed to have killed somebody and was going to kill somebody. If he was threatening Adams next, it could have been Mon, Oct 19. The only reason I suggest this, aside from the fact he was now going to announce "when I shall commit my murders", is that a little known Zodiac correspondence on June 29th 1972 threatened Ed Salmina, a sports editor of the Novato Advance newspaper. It said "If you leave your house past 3:13:47 on the next ten Saturdays, you will be killed". This was listening 10 consecutive Saturdays. The 13 Hole postcard listed Oct 5, the Adams card listed Oct 12, with a further threat just two days prior to Oct 19. I wonder if he had tabled a Monday hit list.
The Zodiac was linked to many crimes, often for little reason, but he too linked himself to varying crimes, thereby suggesting he had greater reach than he did. However, you are on the right track looking for his inspiration in and around October 5th. The red crucifix may have some relevance to a crime he read about - probably unlikely - but you never know.

Shawn

8/15/2019 01:14:34 pm

There appears to be staple holes in the Apollo 8 Stamp on the Pace card. I wonder if that is a xerox distortion pickup, police staple holes or Zodiac staple holes.

https://ibb.co/k4dgv2V

Richard

8/15/2019 01:50:12 pm

These images are nth generation copies, like all the letters and cards, so discerning what was part of the original or just imperfections as a result of the photocopying process, is difficult to say Shawn.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/15/2019 02:47:11 pm

Halloween to come [?] :

The date of the 13 hole card is three weeks prior to Halloween.

The relatively large capital ''T'' employed for '' There are reports...'',appears upside down,as part of the postscript.

This symbol is sometimes known as an ''eet''.....but more commonly known as :

The Graveyard Clipart

And,associated with Halloween.

Indeed,the upside down ''T'',is also known as :

The Halloween Graveyard Clipart.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/15/2019 03:58:38 pm

The postscript is denoted as '' p.s.''.

But since is upside down,appears as '' s d ''

Abbreviated form of many meanings [?].

Perhaps,most apt.....'' Sudden Death''.

Michael

8/15/2019 04:16:20 pm

Zodiac also inspired by Dr. Mabuse?

After a couple of years I just saw Fritz Lang's "Die 1000 Augen des Dr. Mabuse " english title "The 1.000 Eyes of Dr. Mabuse" from 1960.
Dr. Mabuse is a criminal genius who's plan is to shock the country/society by crime and terrorism.
He is always one step ahead of the police using disguises, tech gadgets and by transfoming people to
submissive slaves. This movie and the sequels were also shown in the US.
The eyes on the Halloween card resemble the eyes on the US movie poster stunningly well.
The poster shows 12 eyes, not 13, sorry.

https://www.italo-cinema.de/images/reviews/00000_Reviews/11407_Die-1000-Augen-des-Dr-Mabuse-Plakat03.jpg

Richard

8/15/2019 11:18:56 pm

But Zodiac did only add 12 eyes to the Halloween card - nice find.

8/16/2019 01:24:19 am

Sorry this is off topic, and probably nothing more than drivel, but I was thinking about the cross symbol placement on the costume used at Lake Berryessa. The placement resembles emblems on vests used at olde English Faire's, and one was held around September 1969 in the Bay area. (At least I think that's correct). Since he possibly was a comic reader, I wonder if he was also a fan of the faire's as well. Which put me on a totally different topic, the U.S. Navy Strike Fighter Squadron known as the "Black Knights." They originated as VF unit designations in New York in 1946, and relocated in 1961 to Leemore, California, becoming VFA-154. That got me thinking about Fred Harman's Flying VF Bar. Again, probably nothing, but thought it worth mentioning just the same.

Richard

8/16/2019 02:25:34 am

Also called Renaissance Fairs I believe. Wikipedia: In 1963, Los Angeles schoolteacher Phyllis Patterson held a very small Renaissance fair as a class activity, in the backyard of her Laurel Canyon home in the Hollywood Hills. On May 11 and 12 of that year, Patterson and her husband, Ron Patterson, presented the first "Renaissance Pleasure Faire" as a one-weekend fundraiser for radio station KPFK which drew some 8,000 people. The fair was designed by the Living History Center to resemble an actual Spring market fair of the period. Many of the original booths were no-charge reenactments of historical activities, including printing presses and blacksmiths. The first commercial vendors were mostly artisans and food merchants and were required to demonstrate historical accuracy or plausibility for their wares. Groups of volunteers were organized into "guilds" to focus on specific reenactment duties (musicians, military, Celtic clans, peasants, etc.). Both actors and vendors were required to successfully complete workshops in period language and accents, costuming, and culture, and to stay "in character" while working.
Morris dancers entertain Queen Elizabeth, Renaissance Pleasure Faire, Agoura, c. 1986

The original Renaissance Pleasure Faire of Southern California (RPFS) was held in the Spring 1966 at the Paramount Ranch located in Agoura, California, focusing on the practices of old English springtime markets and "Maying" customs. In 1967, the Pattersons created a Fall Renaissance fair, with a harvest festival theme, first at what is now China Camp State Park in San Rafael, California, and in 1971 at the Black Point Forest in Novato, California. Both fairs developed into local traditions and began a movement that spread across the country.

Richard

8/16/2019 02:28:19 am

Celtic Cross or Renaissance Crusader Cross.
https://www.google.com/search?q=Renaissance+Fairs+cross+symbol&client=firefox-b-d&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi-4JariYfkAhXMQhUIHWZ-ABsQ_AUIESgB&biw=1024&bih=632

Richard

8/16/2019 02:32:30 am

The U.S. Navy Strike Fighter Squadron known as the "Black Knights" also had the crusader style crucifix or cross on the insignia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VFA-154

Rubislaw 32 link

8/16/2019 03:47:40 am

More recently,I have been looking at the ''probability'' that the Zodiac was quite a keen ''crossword puzzle'' buff,when time allowed.

The Zodiac's puzzles offered to readers were something different....but ''words'' and ''cryptacisms'' were certainly in evidence.As if the Zodiac's ''cipher lark'' was simply a progression from crossword puzzles,And,lo and behold,it was the Hardens,who were crossword puzzle addicts,who became the first to solve the Zodiac's ''408''.

In examining the mid section of the 13 Hole card,we may be witnessing a glimpse of is predilection to that form of puzzle.

Vertical 1 : 13 t Z s ........thirteen teases.
Vertical 2 : o d .........overdose

Horizontal 1 : Zodiac ........Zodiac
Horizontal 2 : s d .........sudden death

As an ensemble :

Thirteen teases : Zodiac overdosing on acts of ''sudden death''.

And...with the ''Halloween Graveyard'' symbol,at the foot of this ''insight'' to a crossword puzzle.

Drew

8/16/2019 04:00:14 pm

Hey Richard! I am certainly convinced of its authenticity. For the first time though I noticed something. Is it possible the crucifix is supposed to be a + sign - as in 13+ and if so, considering he had already totalled 13 in the other letter what could the + mean?

Richard

8/16/2019 04:16:12 pm

If so, then possibly the Donna Lass disappearance, sandwiched between July 26th and October 5th. Remember that crucifix formation found in an area near Clair Tappaan Lodge, Norden, California, on Sierra Club grounds, where a rock configuration of 13 stones were positioned in the form of a cross. This area had initially been discovered by Otto Fredericks while out hiking in 1976. It was likely a YMCA "Ragger’s Point" formation, but it's the best answer I can come up with this late Drew.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/zodiackillerfr/lass-grave-site-t7522.html

Rubislaw 32 link

8/16/2019 04:24:37 pm

I can't see it being a '' + '' sign.....no way on earth.

It's a ''Latin Cross'',that could be interpreted as a lower case '' t ''.

The Zodiac would have had to be extraordinarily clumsy,and indeed ''optimistic'',to expect the reader to interpret the ''Latin Cross'',as a
'' + '' sign [?].

Richard

8/16/2019 04:42:13 pm

In all likelihood it is a red Latin Cross, but the reason for its presence on the postcard is manyfold. The 13 Hole Postcard is like the Halloween card - multiple different possibilities. I wouldn't stick my neck out on any of them. The only thing we know for sure to date, is no one answer has been 100% verified. The Tahoe27 Halloween card find is as near certain as one can get. In respect to the 13 Hole postcard - take your pick. But I certainly believe it's by the hand of Zodiac. .

Rubislaw 32 link

8/16/2019 05:01:08 pm

Indeed Richard..I believe also that the 13 Hole card,is by the hand of the Zodiac.

I would only suggest further,since it is a personal opinion,that....

There is something about the Catholicism/Protestantism issue,going on,with the card.The Protestant Latin Cross verses The Catholic Celtic Cross.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/16/2019 04:50:43 pm

It seems to be a key feature of the 13 Hole Card,that it presents the observer,with two contrasting crosses.

To the right-hand side,we can observe the '' Celtic Cross ''.To the pre-Christian pagans,this was known as the '' Sun Cross ''.Those pagans that were converted to Christianity,adopted that same '' Sun Cross '',with which to worship Christ.

To the centre,we can observe the '' Latin Cross ''.The first Christians,from the Middle-East adopted the '' Latin Cross '',with which to worship Christ.But,when there was a breakaway movement,within Christianity,known as Protestantism,then the remaining Catholic Christians desired to make their '' Latin Cross '' different,from the one employed,by the Protestants.

The Catholics added a figure of Jesus,to the '' Latin Cross '',and called it a '' Crucifix Cross ''.

So,the two crosses,featured in the 13 Hole Card are :

i) The Protestant Latin Cross [...central to the card..].

ii] The Catholic Celtic Cross [...to the right,on the card...].

8/16/2019 05:07:49 pm

I've been checking around the dates you gave for the Adams' card. Quite frankly, there is quite a bit in dealing with murder and bombs and such that it's like looking for a needle in a haystack. I think you or someone on this site mentioned the killings of the Dr. Victor Ohta family which made the headlines on October 20, 1971. I found the following link interesting considering that we've been talking about "Knights." If you have a chance to look at this, a bizarre note was left on the rolls royce, which you and others may already be aware of.

http://www.sfweekly.com/news/yesterdays-crimes-santa-cruz-serial-killer-epidemic/

Of course, it is interesting that the Adams card was postmarked from Berkley since there were a series of gun slayings from April - November 1970 around Berkley.

There were also quite a few listings for Renaissance Fairs and costume brochures from early 1969 through the end of 1969.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/17/2019 01:43:05 am

To be in denial,or not....''that'' can sometimes be the question [?].

Dr.Adams was William Joseph Grant's personal psychiatrist,who treated him for addiction to alcoholism and gambling.

According to whom ?

According to Lyndon Lafferty,whose wife Yvonne,was best friend and work colleague of Marian,wife of William Grant.

William Grant was the first official LHR suspect,of adult age.

In 2003,Lafferty was informed,by the CA DOJ,that William Grant's DNA and fingerprints did ''not'' match,those of the Zodiac.

Lafferty still went ahead,with a book,pointing the finger of guilt,at Grant....just as Mr.Rodelli has done,with Mr.X,even though Mr.X was eliminated,similarly,in 2002.

My point ? That Grant had been the subject of Vallejo Police surveillance,on account of LE believing that the Zodiac was impersonating Grant,for which Lafferty was in denial.

Just as Mr.Rodelli is in denial,that Mr.X had been an official suspect,on account of those suspicions being that Mr.X was a ''lookout'' man for the Zodiac....but not the Zodiac,himself.

William Grant and Mr.X....two innocents,and both eventually eliminated,as suspects.

However,I would suggest that....The Dr.Adams ''cut and paste'',The 13 Hole ''cut and paste,and The Benicia High School Note....are all ''shining'' examples of the Zodiac ''falsely telegraphing'' that Grant was Zodiac,himself.

The three aforementioned correspondences have all been accorded ''unconfirmed'' authentication,by the FBI and CA DOJ.

More than a coincidence....or not [?].

Rubislaw 32 link

8/17/2019 05:16:55 am

What I am personally suggesting,with the 13 Hole Card is,that Willian Grant is linked to it,on a number of points....

El Paso [..the pace..] is where Grant trained as a Bomber radio op,during WW2.The card itself,may well have been made from the San Antonio Express...San Antonio,where Grant trained as an Air Cadets instructor.With Texas being the 13th,and final Confederate State,to join the Union.Join the 13 holes,in strict sequence,and the symbol,for a radio wave,is formed.The Celtic Cross....denotes Irish/Scots Catholic origins....which are those of Grant.

The Zodiac [...of Baptist Protestant origins..] was attempting to ''fit'' Grant up,like a ''kipper''.Not least the Celtic Cross link to the Dr.Adams card....with Adams,''attested'' locally,as Grant's psychiatrist.

What I believe,that Lyndon Lafferty never fully understood,was that the Vallejo Police were carrying out a surveillance operation on Grant,because...they were only 10% confident that Grant was the Zodiac....BUT 90% sure that Grant was being impersonated by the Zodiac.

And,therefore belived that Grant could lead them to the Zodiac,and his identity.

Well...the Vallejo Police caught Grant entertaining young men,at Motels....but nothing much else.However,history will record that the Vallejo Police could have hauled Grant in,and charged him,under the sodomy laws,at that time.

Perhaps,''soften'' Grant up....and get him to talk [?].

But they didn't...and as the cops '' hummed and ha'ed '',nothing further,of consequence,was taking place,in investigations.

Then,suddenly,Grant ''bit back'',with a law suit against LE,that succeeded,in putting a halt to the police harassment.....for all time.

''Game over'' for the Vallejo Police.....for all time.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/17/2019 11:21:01 am

And,if I might be given the opportunity....what was actually so ''disreputable'' about Lt.Husted's illegal report,was...

That the Vallejo Police tried to tout it,for the purposes of historic documentation,as evidence that,firstly,they had acted in good faith,in believing Grant to be Zodiac...when the reality was,that they were simply hoping that Grant might lead them to Zodiac.

More,a case,of believing that the Zodiac was a ''spurned'' ex-lover of Grant [?].

But,far far worse...and from an immoral point,that the Vallejo Police,under the leadership of Lt.Husted were compiling this report,largely on behalf of,and for the benefit of Darlene Ferrin's family.

Giving the Suennen family ''false hope'',after ''the horse had already bolted''.

That Lt.Husted wasn't relieved of his duties,on the CA DOJ's discovery of this compiled illegal document,was only because the CA DOJ didn't want this debacle to look any worse for the Vallejo Police,than it already appeared.

So,perhaps,all these years later,when ''naive'' cops like Det,Terry Poyser,close to retirement,looking back with ignorance at what unfolded,with the Vallejo Police,in the wake of the Zodiac's mayhem....and believing that he might be able to ''right some wrongs'',of the criticism of his employers....and the ''damnation'' of law courts....might just reflect that,to even touch what has already been ruined,and a long time ago.....makes the situation even worse.

8/18/2019 10:53:33 am

Rubislaw 32

You never seem to directly say the name. But I think you are saying that it is
the untouchable Judge Raymond J. Sherwin - president of the Sierra Club, and lover of Grant's wife? But, why not just say his name? Is he still too powerful and untouchable even though he is dead? Do you think Marian,wife of William Grant could have left bread crumbs for Lyndon Lafferty, with his wife Yvonne, her friend? Trying to get William made the Zodiac in Lafferty's mind? Roomers?

Rubislaw 32 link

8/18/2019 08:21:09 pm

Hi BB....certainly take it as a compliment,that you should follow my comments,and apologies if I seem to skirt around the ''periphery'' a bit.

No...the Zodiac wasn't Judge Sherwin.

If I get critical of the Vallejo Police...it is because they ''dithered'' over Grant,as a suspect.....and,it cost not only their reputation,but damaged the case,as a whole.

Either they should have arrested Grant,on sodomy charges....or stood back,and waited for further events to unfold....for it is pretty certain that,senior cops didn't think that Grant was actually the ''one'' that was doing the killing.

But then again,maybe the cops were daft enough to believe that Grant was the Zodiac...as opposed to being persecuted and impersonated,''by'' the Zodiac [?].

Judge Sherwin undoubtedly assisted Marian,in seeking help for Grant,to secure his court injunction for police harassment,following the ''car park'' incident...where the VPD ''probably'' gave Grant a ''roughing up'',if not a figurative one,for believing it had been Grant that had assaulted Sherwin.

Sherwin,of course,knew that it had been a much younger man that had put Sherwin in hospital.

It looks like,after Grant's court victory,Marian had demanded that Grant come completely clean with her...probably threatening to leave Grant.

When Grant did come clean,to her...it sent her into a nervous breakdown.And,she was never able to tell,either Yvonne,or her psychiatrist,the whole truth of the matter.''That'',which in effect,constituted the Zodiac's core motive.....which had included persecution and impersonation,of Grant.

This ''truth'',I believe,will eventually emerge,as will the Zodiac's identity.

Both of which,I am unable to state,at present....but would certainly wish to,if I was able.

Time for me to approach another politician.....since,like everyone else,I am getting fed up of the waiting.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/18/2019 12:15:51 am

Just to make a general observation....

All law abiding people would wish a local police force,to succeed in fighting recognized criminal activity.

It is rare that crimes that are,or become high profile ''visit'' what most people might still consider ''provincial'' areas,and it can be a difficult call,for a deparment of justice,overseeing investigation,in such areas,to decide how best,a strategy should be set out.

When such high profile cases do materialize,often is the case that the local police force is ''clammering'' to be given the chance,to show what they are capable of....but so often,it can become the case that,with no previous experience of a crime,on an ''elevated'' scale,in relation to that police force's prior experience....that it becomes apparent that they really aren't up to the unforeseen complexities sometimes emerging...and are prone to actually damaging the chances of a solution....if immediate success,is not forthcoming.

The Vallejo Police weren't the only ones,in matters related to the Zodiac Case.Riverside also,as a police force of similar size,to that of Vallejo.And...perhaps most famously,in the history of the Zodiac case,the San Francisco Police,with the fallout over the Toschi fan mail scandal.

But it has to be said that the Vallejo Police,finding themselves to blame,by ''the law'' itself,over how they handled a situation,involving what many believe,at the time,to be a ''prime suspect'' was perhaps the largest ''real disaster'',in the case's history.....certainly ''handicapping'' for the prospect of future success,in the case.

And,of ''most'' pertinence,that Vallejo,as a provincial city,had become the very epicentre of the case,with strong suspicions that the culprit lived,close by.

8/19/2019 11:08:07 am

The much younger man that had put Sherwin in hospital. Is he known?
Their initials could be put here in this form 24-25-26 (the indirect way of putting x-y-z).
Are they one and the same person? The Zodiac? Sherwin could have made up the assault. Is that possible? Something fishy about it.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/19/2019 11:52:00 am

The man that put Sherwin in hospital,is ''officially'' unknown,BB.

Sherwin caught the man rifling through the contents of Sherwin's car's dashboard locker.Instead of just running away,the man set upon Sherwin,beating Sherwin unconscious.Sherwin was able to give some description of the man....although the public have only been told : ''mid-twenties''.

If,like me,you are inclined to believe that the Zodiac was persecuting and impersonating Grant....then it tends to follow that you would believe that the man was the Zodiac,also.

As most are aware,it was local knowledge that Marian and her boss,Sherwin,were having an affair,at that time....and it is easy to see that the man was seeking to find extra information,that might embarrass Grant,in particular.Not least,the beating that the man,as it transpires,gave Sherwin.

A ''warped'' bonus,if you will [?].

Rubislaw 32 link

8/20/2019 10:41:05 am

Perhaps delving into an area,BB,that few are interested to tread :

What of Marian's confrontation with her husband,after Grant's court injunction victory [?],and her subsequent nervous breakdown,attested by Yvonne Lafferty.

Many things to consider....but,if one is in any way persuaded that Grant,at least knew something more,than he was prepared to admit to both law courts and police,then....

I would suggest that the very basics of Marian's ''horror'',would be that,after Lake Herman Road,further tragic deaths might have been avoided.

8/20/2019 01:23:03 pm

Jealousy being the most dangerous of human psychological experiences. Did Marian think William was cheating on her with Darlene? This being before she found that he was gay. Perhaps hiring a private dick - the likes of William Peek-a-Boo Pennington. He was known for finding-out if a persons significant other was cheating. Perhaps if she thought he was cheating she would hired a hit-man to take Darlene out of the picture. Statistically through-out history most greasers have been cops or x-cops.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/20/2019 02:46:05 pm

I don't presume to know a whole lot more,than is contained in Lafferty's book...but I did swap e-mails with Lafferty,shortly after his book,came out [...about 10 - 12...],and managed to procure a little extra information,from him.Only wish now,that I had found out more,but he was about to embark on a lecture tour,to promote his book.

Grant used to come into Vallejo,regularly,when he was gambling.He would visit an eatery,where Darlene worked as a waitress,for a coffee and read of his newspaper,of a morning...before visiting the illegal gaming basements,for which Vallejo was known.

They knew each other,by courteous acknowledgement only.It would be ridiculous to read into any other type of relationship,between them...not least the age gap.

I suspect that Marian ''knew'' a little of Grant's ''sexual leanings'' already.There was an ''old fashioned'' aspect to the world then,with some marriages....where women were brought up,''not'' to ask certain questions.I think that Marian's suspicions would have been,that a ''spurned'' male lover,might have been at the heart of this.....but,found out different.

What is a ''greaser'' mean,for you,BB ?

In Britain,it often refers to a motorcyclist,like a ''Hell's Angel'',or a ''Teddy Boy''...as in ''Rockabilly''.

8/20/2019 03:41:19 pm

Sorry - many terms slang for hired killer - mechanic, trigger, punk, mop, cowboy,
hood, hooligan, gunsel, muscle, heavy, button man, terminator, bully, clipper, bouncer, shovel, plumber, liquidator, dropper, exterminator, thug, torpedo, Satan, Jack Ketch, etc..
Greaser was more 1930's - 40's popular - it was also slang for the Tommy gun.

Rubislaw 32 link

8/21/2019 04:52:27 am

The 13 Hole Card - a ''summer recess marker'' [?].

With the inclusion of high profile ''unconfirmed'' correspondences,as well as ''confirmed'',The 13 Hole Card plays its role,as a ''marker'' :

For 1970 :

July 26th - Little List Letter

71 days later....

October 5th - 13 Hole Card

And,for 1969 :

August 10th - Concerned Citizen Letter

48 days later....

September 27th - Lake Berryessa Car Door

So,for 1969,there is a break of 7 weeks,in the summer,with no news from the Zodiac.

And,for 1970,there is a break of 10 weeks,in the summer,with no news from the Zodiac.

Working adults,in full-time employment,often take three weeks off,allocated to ''holidays'',for the summer.

The Zodiac was touting himself,as conducting a terror campaign.

And yet,in 1969,the Zodiac takes a 7 week summer recess.

And,in 1970,the Zodiac takes a 10 week summer recess.

Where was he ?

Unlikely,I would suggest,to have been in the Bay Area,where his terror campaign was focused.

8/21/2019 11:57:33 am

William Sullivan it's proven did a lot of dirty work for the proven corrupt Hoover in those days. He wrote the "Kill your self King" letter that came to light in 1968 at the direction of J. Edgar. The Suicide letter here, like the SLA letters portend to be something they are not. They portend to be standing up for the "Good". They are just the opposite.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5f/Mlk-uncovered-letter.png
Note the "You are done" - familiar ring to "You are doomed".

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