CRYPTIC INSPIRATION

7/16/2018

Detective Sergeant Leslie Lunblad

We know the Zodiac Killer mailed his first three letters simultaneously on July 31st 1969, but what inspired him to design a trinity of cryptograms that when combined formed an almost complete and uniform message. It is likely he split the cipher into three parts for maximum newspaper coverage, however, we know little of what inspired him to design the codes in the first place.
The 'Zodiac Killer' pseudonym may never have existed had it not been for the skepticism of Vallejo Police Chief Jack E Stiltz, who insisted the three time murderer send more details to prove he was the 'cipher killer'. It was reasoned that something Zodiac read in the Sunday August 3rd 1969 San Francisco Examiner & Chronicle inspired him to repackage himself from "the murderer" to "the Zodiac". So, what drove the killer of David Faraday, Betty Lou Jensen and Darlene Ferrin to include a cryptogram alongside his deadly deeds and threats. The short answer is, nobody knows for sure- but we do know it took the Lake Herman Road double murderer just over seven months to finally begin his letter writing campaign. Was the killer always planning to kill again and write to the newspapers, or was it the extensive press coverage that inspired him to rise to the picture being painted of him.
It seemed Detective Sergeant Leslie Lunblad beat a lone furrow in the pursuit of the murderer, but he was ably assisted throughout by many agencies, including the Criminal Investigation Bureau in Sacramento, Vallejo Police Department, Napa and Sanoma County sheriff's departments and Sergeant Jack Richard Oller, an investigator in the Fairfield office of the sheriff's department. Jack Oller moved to Oakland, California in 1929 and served in the U.S. Army as a combat engineer in Europe. In 1978, he retired from the Solano County Sheriff Department with the rank of lieutenant.
Along with the Zodiac murder of Paul Stine on October 11th 1969 and the November 21st 1969 San Jose letter and cryptogram, we effectively had the entire shopping list of threats tabled in the 'Fairfield' letter, mailed on December 16th 1969. His threat of 'this state is in trouble..I will go for the Goverment life' may be traced back to a Sunday Times-Herald article on March 30th 1969, in which these law enforcement agencies were pivotal in the search for the Lake Herman Road murderer, including Sergeant Jack Oller. The Zodiac Killer's threat on police in the 'Fairfield' letter centered around Fairfield, Sacramento and Oakland.
The inspiration behind the July 31st 1969 letters and cryptogram is difficult to ascertain, but often with the Zodiac Killer throughout it was something he read that triggered a response, such as the 'Debut of Zodiac' and 'Bus Bomb' letters.
The Sunday Times-Herald article on March 30th 1969 may or may not hold the answers, however, it was published four months prior to the July 31st trinity and did contain some noteworthy passages. Whether these were the trigger for the murderer to begin his letter writing campaign is pure speculation, but in the absence of alternatives it was worth considering.
Here is the newspaper article in full:

More than three months have passed since Vallejo teenagers David Faraday and Betty Lou Jensen were sadistically gunned to death on lonely Lake Herman Road a few miles east of the city outskirts. They were on their first date (the first one she had ever been permitted in her 16 years) and it ended in their deaths.
Now nearly 100 days later, sheriff's investigators concede they are only a bit nearer to the solution of the crime than they were when they arrived on the scene of the grisly slayings that cold Friday night in December. Sheriff's Sgt Leslie Lunblad worked nearly around the clock in the first days following the murders, attempting by some means to produce the clue that would lead him to the killer. He hasn't found it. "There isn't a day that goes by that I don't work on it" the veteran investigator declared. "I've got a case file about four inches thick-all the information I have been able to turn up-and I have a fairly sizeable evidence locker."
The horrifying crime may very well be the most celebrated murder mystery currently under investigation in California, and Lunblad has received aid and offers of it from a score of law enforcement agencies in the state. Those which have given him particularly large measures of support include the Vallejo Police Department, his own sheriff's department, the Benicia Police Department, the Napa and Sanoma County sheriff's departments, and the Fairfield Police Department. " An investigator in San Diego forwarded me information on a case in which he was working which had marked similarity to these two killings, but there was no connection" Lunblad revealed. In the course of his investigation, Lunblad has filed reports of interviews he and Deputy Russ Butterbach have had with at least 50 persons, many of them friends of the slain pair, "I guess we've talked to at least 100 people on various matters, some of them several times" he added. But for all the searching and probing, he has yet to come up with one feasible suspect, and this might well be because the murders have all the aspects of being motiveless, and possibly were committed by a hopelessly deranged person.
The youngsters parents are in complete agreement with this theory. They can think of no one who conceivably hated their children to an extent that would result in cold-blooded murder. Cold-blooded it was: David was killed with a single slug fired behind his left ear. Betty Lou was shot five times in the back as she tried to flee from the assailant. "It's one of those things that just leaves me speechless" said David's mother Mrs Jean Faraday, who talked in her home at 1930 Sereno Dr. "I have been able to think of nothing that would point to David. He was easygoing and friendly, never seemed to have any trouble in school."

The youth, a scalor at Vallejo High, planned to make teaching his career. He was extremely active in Scouting, and was a member of the Interact Club at the high school.
"Last summer, he discovered girls" Mrs Faraday reminisced "but he hadn't done much dating- for one thing he could use the car only when I didn't need it to go to work." She is employed in the passenger reservations department at Travis Air Force Base. She said that when he did take the car for a date "he was good about observing curfews" (12.30 on Friday nights). "So I didn't think a thing about it that night. I was asleep when the phone rang at 3 am."
Mrs Faraday conversed with total composure, although the wounds haven't healed and won't. The same was true of the Jensens. Nothing in his 21 years as an army officer had prepared Lt Col. Verne Jensen for the shock of his younger daughter's death, however. He retired in 1963, decided to remain in Vallejo and now is employed as supply officer for the General Services Administration in San Francisco. The Jensens, with their elder daughter, Melodie, live at 123 Ridgewood Ct. " I don't feel vindictive" he mused "but I am apprehensive. I feel some nut is on the loose."
His words could have been uttered by Mrs Faraday, who said her principal concern that the killer be found was not based on vengeance but on her fears there may be further victims. "And, he'll find it easier the next time."
She said the other three Faraday children Debra, Robert and Steven "have handled the situation very well, I think. Presumably they have long and happy lives ahead of them, and they've got to live them."
The Jensens' lives remain clouded by the tragedy. "We'd like to have her back" Mrs Jensen said wistfully. "It took a lot to bring her this far."
At Hogan High Betty was an excellent student, a junior, she was hopeful of winning an art scholarship and she worked extremely well in several forms, some of which were displayed as I talked to the family. All three shook their heads negatively when asked if they had any ideas to the perpetrator. "We know he's a nut, but what kind of nut" Mrs Jensen replied. She added she was dubious about anything worthwhile could be gained in once again turning the spotlight on the murder case. "But we'll do anything we can to help" she declared.
As for the investigation's progress, Lublad said there has been considerably more than might be gleaned from news accounts of it. "If I talk to a suspect, I'll know positively whether he was there that night" he said cryptically. Beyond that, he would not comment.

It is not difficult to cherry-pick certain phrases and words to fit ones agenda, however, we must consider that the murderer of David Faraday and Betty Lou Jensen likely read this article, and was buoyed by the description of his exploits as a "horrifying crime that may very well be the most celebrated murder mystery currently under investigation in California."
David Faraday's mother summed up her fears: "who said her principal concern was that the killer be found, not based on vengeance but on her fears there may be further victims. "And, he'll find it easier the next time."
She wouldn't have to wait long for the killer to live up to her fears, promising he would "cruse around all weekend killing lone people in the night then move on to kill again, until I end up with a dozen people over the weekend."
Detective Sergeant Les Lunblad's support may too have not gone unrecognized, with his assistance from a "score of law enforcement agencies in the state," including Sergeant Jack Richard Oller and the Fairfield Office.
If this newspaper article was the last major feature regarding the Lake Herman Road slayings, before the killer began his July 4th 1969 attack on Michael Mageau and Darlene Ferrin at Blue Rock Springs, then it is rather unusual that the Sunday Times-Herald article on March 30th 1969 would finish with the thoughts of Detective Sergeant Les Lunblad:in such a manner:
"If I talk to a suspect, I'll know positively whether he was there that night" he said cryptically.
Four months later, the murderer stated "I will not give you my name because you will try to slow down or stop my collecting of slaves for my afterlife," and he too said it cryptically.

33 Comments

Sigmund

7/16/2018 07:02:52 pm

Killers always like to think they are smarter than the police. The Zodiac "got off" on thinking he was smarter than the police.

The problem for the Zodiac is nobody is ever smarter than the police. They only think they are and this becomes a matter of delusional belief. The Zodiac was intelligent to a degree, but he was also delusional.

Modern DNA extraction techniques and analysis may very well have caught up with the Zodiac. I would like to think that his time of anonymity may soon be over, regardless of whether he be alive or long dead.

Richard

7/17/2018 09:35:44 am

We are now months after the supposed DNA tests. It simply doesn't take this long to replicate small samples of DNA using polymerase chain reaction. They know the areas to test- gloves, bindings, stamps and envelope seals. Any full profile DNA result should have been achieved by now and ran through CODIS or the many genealogy sites. The deafening silence to me speaks volumes.

Shawn

7/17/2018 02:41:16 pm

Interesting Statements by Vallejo Cold Case Det. Poyser on May 2nd. A person who has access to lots of evidence but little time to research it. Given his almost giddy favoritism toward the police favorite hand-me-down suspect of ALA I can see he spent little time working the case..... excerpt from Sac Bee article below...

"Our Vallejo suspect is probably still the best lead," Poyser said of Allen. "There are probably 30 different circumstantial things that point to him. ... He was extremely intelligent but a deviant dude."

Allen largely was cleared as a suspect in 2002, when investigators obtained a partial DNA sample from the envelopes that didn't match his. Poyser said that DNA profile only had a few markers on it, less than half of the genetic points needed to definitively clear or identify a suspect.

Poyser said that DNA sample was hampered because technology didn't exist at the time to separate the glue used on the stamps and envelopes from the genetic material. However, science now has advanced to allow a clean grab of the DNA.

Poyser also said Allen was known to have asked other people to lick stamps and envelopes for him, claiming he didn't like the taste of the glue. "One of his friends actually said he did it for him, and we've had a couple people who lived in the neighborhood at the time say they did it as children," he said.

Poyser said if a clean DNA sample is obtained, police might ask those who licked materials for Allen to submit DNA swabs. If they matched the Zodiac profile, it would provide another link to Allen, he said.

Even if Allen doesn't prove to be the Zodiac, Poyser said he believes it was someone familiar with Vallejo, and perhaps with a law enforcement or military background.

Poyser, who plans on retiring next year after 25 years of police work, said he thinks a resolution to the case is possible.

https://www.sacbee.com/latest-news/article210320689.html

Rubislaw 32 link

7/17/2018 04:45:53 pm

Richard,or anyone.....can you clarify the following,for me....particularly,in light of the way,I perceive some newspapers misrepresenting aspects of DNA.

A partial DNA sample,is called a ''partial'' because it is deemed subject to possible contamination,and therefore is known ''not'' to be admissible evidence,in a court of law.

in other words,it is a full DNA profile,but deemed only of potential use to investigating police or judiciary,for the purposes of further investigations.

It seems to me,that there is no such thing as a ''part of a DNA profile''....as opposed to there existing,obviously, a ''part of a fingerprint''.

Any takers,on this point,please [?].

Richard Grinell

7/18/2018 12:42:44 am

Partial DNA Profiles

The SGM Plus system of DNA analysis targets ten loci, each of which contains two alleles. These are the “short tandem repeats” that vary between individuals. In addition, a further locus is targeted that acts as in indicator of the sex of the donor. A “full” DNA profile is one in which all of these loci have produced a reliable and reportable result. Occasionally, the processes used to target some of these loci fail, resulting in an incomplete or “partial” DNA profile. The most common reasons for such failure are either that a very small amount of DNA was present in the sample, the DNA may have become degraded, or that substances may have been present in the sample that may have inhibited the analysis process. Depending on the degree of success of the DNA analysis, the match probability calculated from a partial DNA profile may be reduced below the 1 in 1 billion that would be obtained from a full profile.

Partial DNA can rule out a suspect but cannot definitively identify one.
Imagine a traditional hand fingerprint where say 12 points on the fingerprint are marked and ran through a database. If all 12 are matched you likely have the culprit. Other people may have some of the 12 points but not all. So you may get a million people matching 4 points, 300,000 matching 6 points, 100,000 matching 6 points, but only one matching 12 points. A partial can however point you in the right direction, if you have other corroborating evidence. These figures I've just plucked out of the air, but give a rudimentary explanation.
Imagine a partial fingerprint as a person's description- if we know the killer was 5'10", 200 lbs, black hair, a hook nose, a scar on his right cheek and a mole on his forehead. A partial DNA fingerprint (possibly due to degraded material or small sample) is like a poor eyewitness. If the man arrested for the crime has just three of these features, then we cannot say for sure he is the killer, but if he matches all the features, the likelihood he is the killer increases. A full DNA profile contains so many distinguishing features it can positively identify the donor.A poor eyewitness such as a partial DNA profile may identify a hook nose, or a man of 6'2", which is enough to identify certain individuals, but cannot definitely implicate the killer. If we had full profile identifying 1,000 features, then the chances of this being the killer increases. But what a partial does, like a poor eyewitness, only identifies a a normal nose on a suspect, nevertheless, is enough to rule out a suspect.

Jeanie

9/12/2018 07:51:50 am

Hi Richard,

I do think you need to understand a little bit more about DNA testing. First you must isolate the DNA and given the nature of Z's likely sample(s), very careful and precise techniques need to be used- clean rooms, sterile procedures, etc. This and all the following modern processes should be done by multiple technicians at different times. All it can take is forgetting to change gloves, a sneeze, improper sample handling and you have even more contamination. Also, while the PCR you mention is part of the process, and once you have a small piece specific to the area you amplified with the PCR, it must then be treated and sent to an old school Sanger sequencing machine. Accurate, and I will say relatively quick (24-48 hours) but limited to the fragment in question and its SNPs, single nucleotide polymorphisms- changes in an A, T, C, or G, in a length of at best 1kb, likely smaller assuming the fragment you chose wasn't degraded. Or we can go back further in time and talk about RFLPs that needed a large DNA sample, and other repeat sequences that were used, which sadly are likely the majority of CODIS. But alas, fear not, this is now 2018 and we have second and third generation sequencing technologies that work much better on degraded DNA. Google Illumina or 454 for an explanation. As the typical first step in these processes is shearing the DNA, in essence degrading it, this step would be skipped and the specialized amplification (PCR) would take place creating a library. After many quality checks, the sample could then be run on one of the platforms I mention above. This can take a week or more, and the data generated runs into the gigabytes. The data must then be assembled against the known human genome and can also take days. Hopefully you will see multiple profiles- half our DNA comes from Mom (or Mom also gives us mitochondrial DNA) and the other half from Dad (who gives us his Y chromosome). I would think the mitochondrial DNA could be a safer bet for comparison as it seems as though the police force/handwriting analysts/newspaper reporters were primarily men, so the assembly generated of the mitochondrial genome could provide a way simplify analysis, and also since there are multiple mitochondria per cell, are likely to give a stronger profile. But different genomes, be it the genome entire or just the mitochondria still would need to be separated out. I also mention repetition. The DNA if degraded or sheared would be random, so the more times you repeat the process of library generation, you are likely to get more overlap that can be determined and get out full profiles. For a single person, 6-10X coverage is usually required. In Z's likely contaminated source, more coverage would likely be necessary. Then again, there is the hope that Z's profile would be the dominant one, especially from under the stamp. We are also talking about murders from the 60's, it is likely they would not take precedence, but a private lab could be paid to hurry the process. Now we can compare to, say, genealogical data. Hopefully the likely contaminators would come out on comparative analysis and we would be left with Z. But it is also important to remember it could be wrong, so some investigating needs to happen first. From what I understand, the first "GSK" where the DNA profile led was incorrect. I should also mention there is now third generation sequencing that is likely also taking part. As they all have nuances to them, using all the data would likely be the smartest move for identification of Z. But also, remember the computational time necessary to compare the profiles, and then the time to compare to the databases available. Its not like on TV. I do believe its highly possible for them to obtain his profile, but a lot of work is actually going into it. And yes, I have done all the processes I mention above so if you have any questions, I will be happy to answer.

Richard

9/13/2018 12:00:19 am

Thanks Jeanie, what is your profession. Great information. In March this year the three Zodiac letters were mailed off to a laboratory in California in an attempt to achieve a full DNA profile. Then in May Detective Poyser stated (regarding the 2002 testing) "DNA sample was hampered because technology didn't exist at the time to separate the glue used on the stamps and envelopes from the genetic material. However, science now has advanced to allow a clean grab of the DNA." I contended this was an inaccurate statement because the technology did exist. They may not have got a clean grab, but I have found several examples where in many instances they did. In 2017, Osmond Bell was eventually convicted 36 years after the murder of Nova Welsh in Birmingham, England in 1981 by saliva retrieved from chewing gum he had used to seal the door of a cupboard he had hidden her body in.
In 2000 I found this: "The use of Qiagen QIAamp and QIAshredder for extracting DNA from envelope flaps and stamps is reported. The stamps or flaps can be added directly to extraction solutions and the DNA is bound to a spin column containing a silicon membrane for washing prior to elution. DNA extracted from four stamps and four envelope flaps was amplified and analyzed using a multiplex PCR system. Complete DNA profiles were obtained from five samples."
My point being, the statement that technology didn't exist is a misleading one. It has now been 6 months since these samples were sent for testing behind the envelope seals and stamps. I am not an expert in DNA, but have followed most of the advances- and this seems an awfully long time to have reported no results. Would I be correct in stating that after this length of time, they should have definitive results one way or the other. Is the notable lack of follow up reporting, testimony to the current round of tests having failed to reach a positive conclusion? Is six months an excessive time period for such testing. I have many questions regarding DNA in crime fighting, particularly regarding Zodiac and the 1966 murder of Cheri Jo Bates that I would love to ask a certified DNA forensic expert. If you could help me regarding this it would be invaluable. I have long wanted to write an article using the expertise of somebody with accreditation in this field, to answer the many questions that have dogged the Zodiac scene for years. It would be great if you could help.

Alex Lewis

7/17/2018 11:30:24 am

"The problem for the Zodiac is nobody is ever smarter than the police."

Well it seems that Zodiac didn't need to be a criminal genius of super intelligence to outsmart the SFPD of the day back then. I mean, lets call a spade a spade, the truth of it is that you had the SFPD running around Presidio Heights like headless chickens!

Dozens of marked police cars speeding up & down streets looking for a homicide suspect and while marked police car after marked police car are responding in a sea of red & blue lights, Zodiac having a chat with the occupants of one of these responding vehicles.

"Evening Officers. Have I seen anybody suspicious? Err. . . Yes, Yes I have! There was a man who was running up there waving a gun in the air which, to be honest Officers, I thought was a bit odd! Yeah He went running around that corner up at the next intersection. If you go now you may see him on Washington Somewhere. Byeeeee!"

I bet there was nobody more shocked with disbelief that Cops bought His story and sped off than Zodiac Himself because when He saw cop car slow down & one of it's officers call Him over I would imagine He had to fear the worst & think this is it. . . I lose & Game over!

Sigmund

7/17/2018 05:41:04 pm

Oh yes, he was SO very, very, very smart! Just so long as you keep believing that, that is okay with me.

Rubislaw 32 link

7/18/2018 02:34:59 am

Thanks for the information,Richard.

So,on a layman's observation,the ''charting'' of DNA profile,might be missing some ''markers'',as Shawn refers to,due to the DNA not being of premium quality....for it to be deemed as ''Partial''.

As I suspected,a ''Partial'' can often be used to eliminate suspects,for it may well satisfy investigating police and judiciary......into electing ''not'' to arresting a particular person of interest or covert official suspect.

So,it seems that ''we'' ought to be satisfied with the eliminations,that took place in 2002.

The one suspect eliminated,at the time,that was not made public,was William Grant.

This was because he was ''legally'' not a suspect,at all.....having been officially eliminated in 1971,with the law enforcing ''law enforcement'' to no longer include Grant as being a suspect,ever again.

However,''unofficially'', L.E. were never going to accept that,behind closed doors...and in 2002,Lyndon Lafferty received news on Grant's unofficial status.....for which ''we'' were only to learn about,after Grant's death,in 2012.

The CA DOJ informed Lafferty that Grant failed a DNA match,to the Zodiac,on three of their five criteria.

So,from this information alone,''we'' know that the FBI and DOJ had a Zodiac DNA profile,with which they were confident enough to eliminate certain official suspects.

Looks like a new ''DNA success'',with the arrest of John D Miller [59],for the abduction,molestation and murder of 8 year old April Tinsley,in Indiana,April 1988.

A crime that shocked the whole nation.

He resembles the wild man of Borneo,after a visit to the groomers.

It's all happening,now.

Rubislaw 32 link

7/17/2018 11:04:15 am

Volumes indeed,Richard....and you can put it so much more diplomatically,than me.

The Vallejo Police Department were flat out telling porky pies,at the behest of the CA DOJ,as far as I can see.

There was was one local newspaper that reported that it had tried to ask further questions of the V.P.D.,on two occasions,but no one seemed to be available.

It will be interesting to see,if any newspaper's memory over this matter,doesn't fail them,and follows up the story,at some point [?].

What is quite noticeable is that The Vallejo Times Herald appear to be staying out of this,altogether.They have probably witnessed all too many false dawns,over the years,and have bludgeoned themselves into silence.

Richard

7/17/2018 11:39:53 am

Here is a Cold Justice case. Woman was raped and strangled. A rape kit was sent to the laboratory sealed, and it hasn't been tested in 8 years. This is not uncommon in America due to underfunding. If this woman had been wealthy or of prominence, does anybody believe the rape kit would be sitting unopened for 8 years. It's disgraceful.
https://youtu.be/gtDgP5wOAgE?t=4m32s

Alex Lewis

7/17/2018 01:14:55 pm

"If this woman had been wealthy or of prominence, does anybody believe the rape kit would be sitting unopened for 8 years"

Suspecting this could be somewhere Rhetorical question Rich. I couldn't agree more though mate, anyone who looks at Homicide A being a priority over sand above Homicide based on who the victim isw for example is acting under a mentality that, if I may borrow a quote from Zodiac, is: 'Deplorable at best!'

Funny enough Rich it was only yesterday after I commented on your article regarding the "Later Reports Indicate that a man was observed running into Julius Kahh in the presidio" witness or press statement that I began to think of all the contested claims, the amended accounts or changes to versions of events and I literally found Myself thinking:

"Yeah, He's just some cab driver. So Insignificant that His name isn't worth confirming as accurate & correct before going to print & so...

"T. L.Stine a nobody cab driver is dead! He's Deceased so Who cares if His Name is Paul Lee, He's just a cabbie, right?"

Na, wrong! Cab driver was his profession, it didn't define Him or give Him a status of any kind! Paul, Paul Lee Stine! Human Being, not T. L the Cab Driver! I think Rich it may be deliberate dehumanising people. Maybe it is easier to cope with then?

Paul Stine, He was a Real Person with real Parents, Siblings & A Wife! All of whom love and miss Him more than I could hope to ever be able to know or understand! Paul Stine has every and as much right to live as the Prince of Wales or the President of The United States!

Alex Lewis

7/17/2018 01:17:02 pm

I don't see nor recognise a class of person and certainly don't subscribe to any presumption that because (Just simply and only using as an Example here) Homicide Victim Mr Kjell Qvale as a bit more, let alone far more important to solve, than Some Cabbie called Paul who got shot dead!

That kind of thinking is A man made mythical idea based on society being structured the way it is.

Its simply a shame and saddens me that the Law Maxim that declares:

Legal Maxim tells You & I Rich: "Equality in law is paramount"

Is it? Really?

Arguing against this notion being a true, accurate & observed today as a must is Alex, who begins with Exhibit A - Evidence!

https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/documents/FactSheet.pdf

Karen C

7/17/2018 05:51:46 pm

Look at the case of the Friendly murders in Palm Springs. These WERE wealthy people, but to date their murders still remain unsolved. The number one suspect apparently escaped the grasp of authorities even though the FBI tracked him through South America and into Africa, where it is believed he began working as a weapons dealer and mercenary. He was finally captured in Europe for bank robbery but was let out on some technicality and he could not be extradited due to an impoverished Palm Springs office not having the funds or inclination to arrange for an extradition order. This is a wealthy part of America but with an apparently underfunded sheriffs office??! WTF?

"Only in America!" as they say. In America money often speaks louder than words. Still I have hope for the future, as we have seen several diligent police detectives taking the time to re-examine cold cases, often under the guidance of a diligent D.A. Now is the time for relatives of the victims to become vocal and demand answers from their local D.A. and Sheriff.

Alex Lewis

7/17/2018 01:34:21 pm

I feel passionately about Capital Punishment and am on all levels, morally, ethically and innately opposed to the Death Penalty so when I Saw earlier that America has had a eureka! moment and decided they need to start snuffing citizens out via Nitrogen Gas, (Hydrogen Cyanide was a bit ugly for witnesses as they gagged and heaved while drooling down their shirts in a suffocated dignified death!) and so, Me being the huge pot of obnoxiousness that I am, commented:

"WelshChappie Says:

Allow Me to apologise on behalf of Europe for our deplorable refusal to send America it's Lethal Injection Drugs. Yes, it really is logical, rational and displays intellectual Brilliance as America attempts to defeat homicide by executing those that kill with a seeming view that suggests 'We have a disease called Murder, execution is the breakthrough cure and once We have executed all the murderers. . . then Murder will go away and wiped out.

Flawless! What a fantastic plan America, Nothing can go wrong! Lets celebrate this wonderful breakthrough with a half dozen Electric Chair fryings! Ah yes, pure Nostalgia!

Personally I am partial to the firing squad Myself I still do not understand why it couldn't be shot in it's head. Sorry, did I say 'it'? I mean 'Him' as these are people and umm, etc!

Serious though, Maybe States could put as much effort into repairing an economy that is still in pieces and, ooooh, yeah.. Maybe we could resume executions by gassing a few bankers who paid themselves bonuses of Fifty, maybe A Couple Hundred Million dollars etc when they knew the economy was decimated because they decimated it and awarded themselves $50,000,000 for a job well done and all that. Can we execute our way through criminal bankers, I am already looking for the Nitrogen!

Alex Lewis

7/17/2018 01:54:11 pm

The Article in Question:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/america-death-penalty-nitrogen-gas-execution-method-oklahoma-alabama-mississippi-a8340896.html

I did laugh though at a defiant John Gacy as He was asked when strapped down to the Gurney if The Prisoner wished to make a final statement said:

"Yeah. . . Kiss My Ass!" Then the Execution began.

I did find His giving the establishment the Finger at such time amusing because it isn't at all expected! 99.8% of those who are minutes away from certain death are shaking with fear and use their last couple minutes to tell the people present how sirrt they are and begin uttering prayers to themselves etc as they die. Not John!
Gacy, it seems, was defiant to the end!.

Karen C

7/18/2018 10:10:20 pm

Of course! Instead of frying the magnificent brains of these unique "national treasures", they should be rewarding them with ice cream, chocolate cakes, and free limitless internet.

Tom

7/18/2018 04:54:06 pm

Stay in Europe. You guys are letting your political views affect your reasoning power.

Sigmund

7/17/2018 04:58:51 pm

Well it seems a lot of armchair critics think they are smarter than the police, that much is certain!

I say it again, nobody is beyond the law. Nobody is ever smarter than the police. To think they are is a delusion of their own making. If they get away with it, they generally do so by sheer luck alone. The Zodiac was not smart. He was lucky. I personally think his luck must run out sooner or later.

But of course this will not please those who seem determined to turn him into a legend. Writers on this blog page and various forums seem to be doing a better job at turning him into a legend than actually investigating him.

People on forums are generally very impatient. I remember hearing similar things from posters about GSK. They said the authorities will never catch him. "He is too smart." "All this DNA talk won't solve the case." etc. etc. etc. Well his luck did eventually run out, and it was thanks to hard investigative work and the help of DNA. Similarly, Crawford's decades of luck eventually came to an abrupt end.

Or maybe some may prefer BB's derived "logic", that it was the CIA all along. It's "case solved", even when it's not.

One thing I am certain about. Nobody on any of these forums or blogs will ever solve the Zodiac case. If it ever is solved, it will be by diligent police doing diligent investigative and forensic work.

Rubislaw 32 link

7/18/2018 04:19:43 am

On a general observation,Richard,to your article,specifically.....that again touches on one of the great mysteries of Zodiac's officially confirmed Bay Area serious crimes.

How it was that there was a 6-7 gap,between ''LHR'' and ''BRS'' [?].And further,how it was that ''LHR'' was the one,for which Zodiac didn't own up for,immediately.

It is no secret that I believe that Zodiac was persecuting William Grant.Given what we now know,as Zodiac's violent capabilities,why did Zodiac not just murder Grant ?My belief is that Zodiac's primary goal,was to make Grant's life a ''living hell''.To make Grant suffer,and to enjoy witnessing Grant suffer.

The reason for this,represents the core motive of Zodiac.All the publicity that materialised,fell into Zodiac's lap,and Zodiac took to it,like a duck to water.And,as a consequence,Zodiac unwittingly confused the majority of observers,over ''core motive''.

But,returning to ''LHR'',specifically...it may be of interest to everyone,that the legacy of ''LHR'',for Detective Sergeant Leslie Lunblad was,that he believed that William Grant had murdered Betty Lou and David,at ''LHR''.

We are not privy to details how Lunblad,the chief investigating officer,at LHR,came to this conclusion.

History suggests that it was the wrong conclusion,since we now know,at the very least,that William Grant was eliminated,to L.E's satisfaction,in 2002.

From Zodiac investigator,Lyndon Lafferty's journals and diaries,there was no one,more devastated than Lunblad,when William Grant won a harassment injunction against the investigating police.

Grant was now ''off limits'' for good.

Lunblad ended up taking early retirement,and so,Lunblad's son believes,contributed to Lunblad's early death.

How could Lunblad,perhaps in the best position of anyone to know who might have killed Betty Lou and David,get it plain wrong,as history observes ?

Perhaps because Grant was just not Zodiac,but Zodiac's impersonation of Grant,at ''LHR'',as the start of Zodiac's vendetta,was successful.

In what way ? We do not know.

But I would suggest that same model of motorcar,would be a good starting point [?].

Tom

7/18/2018 07:39:35 pm

I missed the connection between Grant and Mr. Z. Can you point me to some source material on that?
Thanks again,
TM.

Karen C

7/18/2018 10:11:49 pm

You haven't missed very much Tom. ;-)

Rubislaw 32 link

7/18/2018 11:15:03 pm

Yes Tom,Lyndon Lafferty's book is called ''The Zodiac Killer Cover-Up''.AKA''The Silenced Badge''.

The title refers to Lafferty's theory that Grant's harassment injunction victory,against the cops investigating him,for being the Zodiac.....was unfairly won,in a court of law....and,the result of a cartel of high powered people,that actually sought to cover up the ''fact'' that Grant was Zodiac.

So...a bit of ''fantasy land'' from Lafferty,then.But it's still a fascinating read,and illustrates the quantity of discoveries,pertinent to the Zodiac case,that Lafferty made.

In addition,some ironically hilarious aspects....like how Lafferty and Grant's wives became best friends,and that,on occasion,Lafferty and Grant were forced to socialise together.

On these occasions,uncomfortable for Lafferty,he would always insure that,to be on the safe side,he would ''pack a weapon'' [!].

Karen C

7/18/2018 03:56:41 pm

We can all thank Lafferty for providing the Zodiac case with a good (or "bad", depending on our inclinations) dose of wild, colorful and vivid imagination. As if there were not, by that time, enough "pulp fiction" authors already getting in on the action by that time. The post-60s drift of skunk weed clearly still hung heavily in the air. I have read Lafferty's book. A fantastic tale if ever there was one! A cross between Ripping Yarns and Ripley's Believe it or Not. While reading it, I did at times wonder if he may have secretly co-authored it with Sandy Betts. At least the overall content and tendency to speculate/elaborate wildly and exaggerate whenever it seemed convenient to do so was remarkably similar.

Tom

7/19/2018 08:33:03 pm

Not to beat a “live horse” but has anyone considered running the mathematical probabilities on Ms Sandy’s various renditions of her life experiences.
Whoops sorry,
TM

Sigmund

7/20/2018 04:34:45 am

In the absence of verifiable evidence and in terms of probability, the solution can only ever be trivial.

"x" stands for "Those who think most of her statements about Zodiac are true"
"y" stands for "Those who think most of her statements about Zodiac are untrue"

So:
xy/(xy+(1 - x) (1 - y))

Rubislaw 32 link

7/18/2018 04:54:45 pm

It is understandable,Karen,that you should feel this way about Lyndon Lafferty's book.

At the end of the day,Lafferty,like Lunblad,called it wrong,in believing that William Grant was the Zodiac.

Lafferty was the quintessential ''honest good cop'' that got a whiff of something,locally,that didn't smell right.

I believe that history will show that he lead us to the correct watering hole,but was found wanting,in assuming that it was the brand of water that would quench everyone's thirst.

Corny metaphors aside,Lafferty probably uncovered more information,pertinent to the Zodiac case,than any amateur investigator,including Robert Graysmith.

Perhaps he was just a bit ''all over the place'',and this tended to come out,in his book.But he was certainly honest,and always stated that he was unable to explain something,that he had discovered,if this was the case.

Although he got on quite well with Ms.Betts,later in life,they were at loggerheads over their respective claims,as to who actually attended the ''paint party''.Since the ''paint party'' was actually the ''pot party'',it is hardly surprising that a number of locals denied any knowledge of it,not least,who actually attended.

Lyndon Lafferty was the ''darling'' of the local press.A man who forever wished to share and engage with others,on any matters to do with the Zodiac case.

I was fortunate enough to have had a relationship of correspondence with him....even though he was aware that I was coming from a different angle,to him,over William Grant.

Whenever I became cheeky enough to ask him uncomfortable questions,over ambiguities or apparent contradictions,he would revert to talking about his pet hobby,which was studying the case of ''Jack the Ripper''.

Lyndon Lafferty's enthusiasm for the Zodiac case,was simply contagious,and is one of the vary few,that can rightfully regarded as a Zodiac ''legend''.

Judith

7/19/2018 08:20:16 pm

Interesting, how many people claim that suspects have been eliminated based on the so-called partial DNA profile. That sounds like law enforcement has a lot of faith that this partial DNA is actually from the Zodiac. Paternity DNA is determined by markers or alleles. I believe a full profile is considered 13 markers now and this partial only held four or five markers. Either you're DNA matches those four or five markers or it doesn't. This is why suspects have been eliminated. I was told by Napa Sheriff's that the DNA results from their testing of the Berryessa evidence came back with only some partials that did not match SFPD. I'm going to have to assume that the Riverside DNA profiles from the cigarette butt and the wrist watch do not match the DNA partial from SFPD. Mine and Peter's oldest son Stephen Plante has been incarcerated during his entire adult life as a felon in the state of California. Technically they should have taken his DNA and entered it into CODIS . I also provided law enforcement with our youngest son's DNA profile that I submitted through a testing website. In 2012 California Department of Justice came to interview me regarding Peter as the Zodiac. I can only assume that there must have been a match to the partial DNA profile. Having said that, someone stated that just four or five markers would potentially match 225,000 white males from the Bay Area in 1969.

Rubislaw 32 link

7/20/2018 02:09:17 am

I have just read everything you have written,carefully,Judith.

We can go round and round in circles,over this....and even if we were complete forensics experts,we still might not have all the answers [?].

I believe that ''The authorities'' are confident of ''one Zodiac'',and have known this person's profile,since 2002,at the latest.

But,''big buts''.Firstly,that,in 2002,they were not any nearer to matching that profile with a particular person,despite confidence in eliminating certain long standing official suspects,like Arthur Leigh Allen.

Though,it may well be different now,and tend to think that that ''one Zodiac'' is known to them.

In addition,despite their confidence in ''one Zodiac'',they would not allow themselves,professionally,to accept this as a certainty,and will still have a ''contingency'' strategy of investigations,for the possibility of the phenomenon of Zodiac,being a small group of criminals.

And,this is why,I believe,''Peter'' enters the ''movable'' equation.

But also,it doesn't make my perception correct,just because that it is the way I see it.

I think you just have to be patient,Judith,and not expect anything ''any day,now'' [?].

Ms.Betts has informed us,on the Zodiac sites,that,with all this new found excitement,following the announcement from Det.Poyser and the V.P.D.,that ''her suspect'' has fled to the California/Mexico border.

No doubt,waiting to decide whether he might have to seek exile in Mexico,if,as expected by Ms.Betts,that a resulting DNA profile,exposes him,once and for all,as the Zodiac.

It could be a long wait ?

Sigmund

7/20/2018 04:46:17 am

Funny how Ms Bett's stories always seem to be impoverished in terms of evidence but very generous in terms of "convenience". Just stating the obvious. LOL!

Judith

7/20/2018 06:43:18 am

Interesting point about others having been possibly involved with Zodiac. In fact there are others still alive whom I believe were very close to Peter during the classic crimes and continued to be so during his life and they are still alive. I believe these two men had sexual relationships with Peter.
The DNA results from the recently submitted Vallejo evidence might shine light on several involved helpful people. Having said that, my belief is Peter acted singularly as the actual killer, his ego being the size of the state of Montana.

Rubislaw 32 link

7/20/2018 08:00:15 am

Yes Judith,on the matter of ego,it certainly stands out as one of the key factors,that suggests that Zodiac acted alone.

However,this should be balanced with the understanding that,Zodiac was peddling the ''persona'' of the Zodiac,and not the real person behind the mask.

Down to brass tacks....one of your disadvantages is,that the person that you accuse of being the Zodiac [Peter],is now deceased.

If the authorities are,for example,dealing with ''one Zodiac'',whom they know to be now dead,then its a case of looking around for possible guilty associates,that are still alive and can be prosecuted,before revealing the identity of the deceased Zodiac,who was,in effect,''Mr.Big''.

If,on the other hand ''Mr.Big'' is still alive,the authorities need to concentrate all their efforts on bringing him to justice.And,any possible guilty associates can wait,as a secondary consideration....with ones that are now deceased,taking the very back of the queue.

So,for you Judith,if Peter is either ''Mr.Big'',or a possible associate,you get to hear last.

Simply because Peter is now dead,and can't be prosecuted.

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